Active Stock Picking vs. Indexing Challenge

[Sniper]

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are u sure about praa? look at this chart
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=%5ES...q=l&c=praa,ijr

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His timing on PRAA was perfect... better chart to see it

[AvivaSimplex]

I never intended it that way. Obviously rock would prefer it because it makes him look less bad. It doesn't really matter since there's no money on it. The bottom line is that in the real world it matters not only whether you beat the indices, but more importantly, by how much.

[Sniper]

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The bottom line is that in the real world it matters not only whether you beat the indices, but more importantly, by how much.

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course!

Update... Aviva 30.95% vs RockRock 9.89%

[Mr. Now]

I notice the reported returns are not risk-adjusted.

If Aviva is taking more than 3.13 the total risk RockRock is taking, Aviva is the net loser.

[Sniper]

[ QUOTE ]
I notice the reported returns are not risk-adjusted.

If Aviva is taking more than 3.13 the total risk RockRock is taking, Aviva is the net loser.

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Risk adjusted was not part of the challenge, but I doubt that Aviva's risk is 3x in any event!

[rockrock]

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I notice the reported returns are not risk-adjusted.

If Aviva is taking more than 3.13 the total risk RockRock is taking, Aviva is the net loser.

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Risk adjusted was not part of the challenge, but I doubt that Aviva's risk is 3x in any event!

[/ QUOTE ]

Neither was an entire group of stock's performance versus a group of indexes collectively but that hasn't stopped you from proclaiming me a loser.

Note that PRAA is now a loser versus the small cap index.

Sniper, If you don't want to grade me by 6:5 on each security versus the underlying index (which of course you will lose given enough securities) then maybe you should stop bringing this thread up like some obtuse two year old that doesn't understand what's going on.

To recap, Jim Cramer made some stock picks for an imaginary bet where I got 6:5 on each security versus the underlying index and I am barely losing despite Cramer's reach and ability to endless tout the stocks if he so wishes.

Hardly worthy of the savage glee you display in bumping this thread.

The only other way we could have done this, Sniper, would for me to have constructed a portfolio of indexed mutual funds to take on the securities listed. I would have chose something like:

30% IJS
20% BRSIX
20% EEM
10% EFV
10% VPL
10% PISRX(no small cap intl mutual fund)

Either way, Cramer is still beating me and you are a still acting like a jerk.

[rockrock]

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I never intended it that way. Obviously rock would prefer it because it makes him look less bad. It doesn't really matter since there's no money on it. The bottom line is that in the real world it matters not only whether you beat the indices, but more importantly, by how much.

[/ QUOTE ]

That wasn't the challenge but nice try.

btw - if you ever want to bet some serious money on this proposition (your stocks versus my index choices) you can really win something and I'm easy to find.

[rockrock]

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rock, if I wanted to take you up on your challenge, who would hold the money?

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PM me if you are serious - we can find someone we both trust to hold it and just so there isn't any confusion, let me put this in a way you will clearly understand -- you can do a 'mon back.

[rockrock]

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sniper - yes he and cramer are doing great, but my original challenge had me getting 6 to 5 and I am down less than 2 units by my count overall....Not sure what your point is.

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I am trying at this point to clarify the challenge!

Are you saying that rather than the challenge being port against port... you are saying that each individual pick is a seperate bet???

[/ QUOTE ]

Sniper try reading the original post. Since you still seem confused on this, let me:

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Choose from 1 to 500 stocks in any asset class (doesn't matter - emerging markets, reits, small cap, large cap, mid cap, microcap) other than international small cap (since there is no index).

I will pick an index mutual fund or etf that corresponds to the asset class of those equities (i.e. if you want to pick small caps i would pick IJR, midcaps MDY, micro I would choose IWC, etc)

I will bet I am ahead after any time frame longer than 6 months.

Since I am clearly the underdog here, you must lay me 6 to 5.

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[jively]

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10% PISRX(no small cap intl mutual fund)

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DFISX: DFA Intl Small Company is a very good passive international small company fund. It is not an "index" per se, as DFA does not stick to rigid indexes. But, it is very passive and does give you the returns of the asset class.

-Tom