Absolute Cliffsnotes (Mod edit: AP thread, part 2)

[indianaV8]

[ QUOTE ]
Now, I have read enough and have no desire for another 100 pages full of speculations. Possibly, I am a newbie idiot who wants to know the truth, finally. Maybe I am wrong with my supposition. I do not know it. But I search for an answer and could not sleep last night. IMHO we should stop beating around the bush. What I wanted to know is a clear answer to my following questions:

1. Is this Screenshot manipulated?
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showfl...=1#Post12105122

2. Could the following software tools be the means to support the cheating attacks, we discuss in this thread:
How it works and more
One example
And here is another, a more serious one

[/ QUOTE ]

This is clearly a troll. Even very surface reading (of the third link e.g.) clearly says it DOES NOT WORK for heads up:

Opponents Hole Cards
This feature will work on any table that is designed for 6 or more players. This will currently not work for heads up play. Good for tournament tables and ring games alike you will be given one of your opponents pocket cards with up to 100% accuracy. You will also be given a suit value that will match either one or both cards. From this information you can be alerted to a possible flush if the community has the potential for a flush. Match this with the information given in PokerRNG and you have a greater chance of avoiding disaster or making a call that could put you in a great chip position.

[PartyGirlUK]

adanthar - what about suing Seif, if it turns out he's involved?

[adanthar]

[ QUOTE ]
adanthar - what about suing Seif, if it turns out he's involved?

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe. I'd honestly hate to be the lawyer on that case, though.

just thinking of the jurisdiction issues + what the trial (and publicity) would be like + trying to collect afterwards...lol

[dibbs]

[ QUOTE ]


maybe. I'd honestly hate to be the lawyer on that case, though.

[/ QUOTE ]

Haha seriously, "Your honor, the alleged claimed he was going to get his boomswitch, and then CHECKRAISED EVERY BLUFF FOR LIKE 100 HANDS! AND HE WAS ALWAYS RIGHT! Just look at this river aggression number....."

I hate to think sweeping this under the rug would be the better option but I think a court case, even if it only got a few blurbs in the news and online would be very bad thing for the game atm.

[crashjr]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
adanthar - what about suing Seif, if it turns out he's involved?

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe. I'd honestly hate to be the lawyer on that case, though.

just thinking of the jurisdiction issues + what the trial (and publicity) would be like + trying to collect afterwards...lol

[/ QUOTE ]

The jurisdictional issues against Seif aren't bad at all. The initial problem is getting testimony, since if he is incriminated he has committed a felony and will also be subject to disbarment. The main problem is collecting afterwards. I wouldn't take this case on a contingency basis.

[fnord_too]

Has anyone contacted other sites yet? Seriously, if this pans out, it would be a huge blow to online poker and all the other providers should be working on spin control. This sucks, it's horrible, but if it is true the worst thing that could happen to those robbed is for the story to take the other sites down with them (or to further support the anti on-line poker movement in the US).

At the very least all the big sites should be developing risk mitigation strategies. Also, Costa Rica would probably be pretty interested in this because if it is true they stand to lose a lot (due to on line casino's not conducting business under their auspices due to the taint, if the story gets wide spread).

There are a lot of ifs still, but this could really put the whole industry at risk. Consumers are not exactly rational on whole, and many are predisposed to believe on line games are rigged since that is preferable to admitting to themselves that they suck.

[bap2086]

[ QUOTE ]
Hi I found this hand in the original limit thread. This hand looks like chip dumping imo. Grinder and Seif are screwed!

STAGE #753361340: HOLDEM NO LIMIT $30 - 2007-09-04 17:27:15 (ET)
Table: ALHAMBRA (Real Money) Seat #3 is the dealer
Seat 3 - HEro ($6881 in chips)
Seat 4 - THE GRINDER ($5970 in chips)
Seat 5 - DOUBLEDRAG ($21702 in chips)
Seat 2 - DTON21 ($1110 in chips)
THE GRINDER - Posts small blind $15
DOUBLEDRAG - Posts big blind $30
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to hero [10d 3c]
DTON21 - Folds
hero - Folds
THE GRINDER - Raises $135 to $150
DOUBLEDRAG - Calls $120
*** FLOP *** [As 4h 8s]
THE GRINDER - Bets $180
DOUBLEDRAG - Calls $180
*** TURN *** [As 4h 8s] [6d]
THE GRINDER - Checks
DOUBLEDRAG - Checks
*** RIVER *** [As 4h 8s 6d] [5d]
THE GRINDER - Checks
DOUBLEDRAG - Bets $5550
THE GRINDER - All-In(Raise) $5640 to $5640
DOUBLEDRAG - Folds
THE GRINDER - returned ($90) : not called
*** SHOW DOWN ***
THE GRINDER - Does not show
THE GRINDER Collects $11758 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total Pot($11760) | Rake ($2)
Board [As 4h 8s 6d 5d]
Seat 2: DTON21 Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 3: hero (dealer) Folded on the POCKET CARDS
Seat 4: THE GRINDER (small blind) collected Total ($11758) All-In HI$11758) [Does not show]
Seat 5: DOUBLEDRAG (big blind) Folded on the RIVER

[/ QUOTE ]

wow u just never see anything like this in these types of games. 0 action throughout the hand basically then boom 5.5k all in and guy moves in for $150 more or something and he folds.

this is just blatantly ridculous. i always saw the grinder in alot of doubles games too.

[nichtsnutz]

Am I the only one who's withdrawing money?

[dibbs]

[ QUOTE ]
This sucks, it's horrible, but if it is true the worst thing that could happen to those robbed is for the story to take the other sites down with them (or to further support the anti on-line poker movement in the US).

There are a lot of ifs still, but this could really put the whole industry at risk.

[/ QUOTE ]

My thoughts exactly, yea I'd be super heated if I was robbed too, and would want to make a noise loud enough for this to stop and not happen again, but thinking unemotionally the bigger issue would be not to make so much noise that it potentially cripples the entire industry.

[RiverFenix]

[ QUOTE ]
Am I the only one who's withdrawing money?

[/ QUOTE ]

Left ~20bi in took everything else out.