Resolution of the Stars investigation.

[betadecay]

[ QUOTE ]
one was too stubborn and pig headed to admit that perhaps he made a mistake and the other was willing to take his word on it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well I'm sure Lee can't take time off whatever it is he does to double check every single complaint Stars gets about customer mistreatment, especially for a nano-limit player. I don't think there is anything Lee could have done better here. Obviously Stars deals with issues similar to this on a regular basis. There are people in charge of these issues. It just happened that one of those people made a mistake. You can't really blame Lee for that.


[ QUOTE ]
AND, why is it that Stars seem unwilling to listen to individual complaints about a situation but they will go to the highest levels when there is a massive long thread in 2+2 about it?

[/ QUOTE ]

Again this is the same as above. I doubt there is a check system in place at stars where decisions are run through a number of people before coming to action. This just wouldn't be practical. It seems one person made a mistake on a nano-limit account. Unfortunately that one decision-maker seems to have had some clout in whatever department he was in. That kind of screws the account holder.

Luckily it was someone associated with 2P2. I don't think there would have been any other way that this would have been re-evaluated without the 2p2 community getting thier panties in a twist. It simply takes the issue from one nano-limit account and makes it an issue for several accounts accross many limits. Obviously Stars will have to address the issue with more scrutiny. It is not reasonable to ask Stars to take the same level of scrutiny with every issue that they deal with. Again that is impractical.

In the end it was resolved and handled correctly. Pat on the back to Teddy and the 2p2 community for bringing it to Stars' attention. Now they can put measures into place that will prevent it from happening again.

[MakesCents]

no, had it been someone else they woulda created an acct here to complain and we would have all replied that he/she should stop cheating and they wont get banned. You know thats the truth

[BluffTHIS!]

I was one of those in the other thread who made a couple references to Teddy either perpetrating an elaborate joke or being in fact guilty. Mostly I thought it was 95% joke and 5% guilty, because I didn't really see how this could be true. What made me believe that it could be was Wheel Gunner's proposed explanation that a recreational player multitabling might just act as the windows popped up, instead of the way we in these forums do with constantly using check box actions in advance so we can concentrate on the hands we are really playing and have money invested in. Again, I really thought all this was an elaborate prank, but the old saying truth is stranger than fiction seems to apply here.

But all this does say something about stars, and other sites as well. They are so paranoid about bots they can go overboard, but regarding human player collusion, then as I posted in my earlier thread Poker Stars And Game Integrity - The Emperor With No Clothes , and in which Lee declined to respond, there are so many inadequately addressed issues regarding game integrity issues. Stars is not of course the only site with these deficiencies, but as the one who has over time constantly held themselves out as doing the utmost to insure game integrity, then it is only fair we hold them to a higher standard.

Many of us here, including myself, really do hold Lee in high regard both for his own personal integrity, and for his and his site's willingness to come here and address issues, which party has said they would but instead has shown themselves to be a liar for not doing so. But Lee doesn't own the site, and he has superiors to answer to. I hope that they will learn from this episode and not only come here and address it, but also the other issues in the thread linked above. And that they have the guts to say they haven't been doing enough with human collusion/cheating, and have been doing too much or taking the wrong actions regarding bots.

But all of this presuposes the management of stars still cares about the longterm, and isn't just coasting until they can find a buyer for the company. Most of us really want stars to succeed longterm because of Lee and other things, and also because they are the most likely to provide a competitive counterweight to the market leader who doesn't give a [censored] about the business of the portion of its customers who post here. So we will just have to see what happens, but my gut says stars will be bought by a company that links it to a sportbook and casino to try to draw money out of poker into -EV gambling like the others. In that case, there will be no reason at all to favor stars over any other site.

So again, assuming still as seems likely this isn't in fact the most elaborate joke perpetrated on this site, then my hat is off to Teddy for his persistence and handling of this matter, and I'm sorry to have insinuated even a 5% chance of his being guilty.

[Gregatron]

The whole "I bet Teddy's mom is hot" stuff is funny and all, but you are taking this too far. But when you say crap like this you are really being a major ass. No wonder he doesn't want his mom to see this forum -- idiots like you.

[bwana devil]

i hope lee comes here and explains why this error was made in the first place and what steps they are inacting to make sure it does not happen again.

one of those steps in the accusation of boting should be that each person is given the chance to have his account reviewed by another party at stars. having one person review all grievances and discouraging the person accused from forwarding the complaint on is really bad policy.

bwana

[Teddy\'s Mom]

Now I plan on purchasing a bot, they wont be expecting it now!

[train.]

[ QUOTE ]
it was discovered that Jeff had made an error in his finding that my mom had been using a bot. Both Jeff and Lee have written emails to my mother acknowledging the mistake and apologizing with both humility and extraordinary class. Jeff also apologized for the aggressive and sometimes stubborn tone that he used in his emails. I want to state up front that they really did handle this 'mea culpa' with extraordinary professionalism and class.


[/ QUOTE ]

I am still disappointed that someone from stars has not come here and addressed the issue directly to this community. Have they actually stated where the mistake was made? Have they acknowledged that, no, your mom didn't play for 43 straight hours , on several occasions.

I appreciate that they have acknowledged a mistake and have appologized for the tone of the correspondence to your mom. And maybe they don't owe "us" any type of explanation. It was your mom who they wronged and have righted that wrong. It would still be nice to hear from them that they value our opinions and misgivings concerning this matter.

I think you should consider posting the lastest emails from stars if they don't accede to your request for them to post a reply here.

edit: of course this drama only started "here" a little over 3 days ago. and while most of us have been following it and waiting for each succesive post to learn the latest (at least I have) 3 days is really not that long of a time period for stars to do their investigation, draw their conclusions and then reply first to teddy and his mom and then hopefully to us.

[jason_t]

Why hasn't ColdCaller posted in this thread yet, oh why?

[grjr]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1) 100% correct. My mother's account was NOT active for 43 straight hours. Jeff's email said that the security measure they had in place initially identified that time period as having been 43 straight hours, and he simply made a mistake when he investigated in more detail.

[/ QUOTE ]

6) Please don't tell me that the ONLY evidence they had against your mum was that she played for 43 straight hours (they thought)?

That alone was enough to get her account closed? Was enough to get Jeff bragging about what an incredible technical genius he is, and how sophisticated Stars' highly secret, state of the art, bot detection algorithms are?

Please don't tell me that....

[/ QUOTE ]



"Please tell me you have something more, Lieutenant.."

[MakesCents]

OMFG this is in no way any worse than anything anyone else has said. Its a joke man, lighten up. Get a grip.