Need your opinion... Does this wife owe him more?

[beenben]

H should be concerned about the grass being greener. There could definitely be some l o n g a r s e hours at a gigasmic law firm. They have to bill an extraordinary amount of hours which means they have to put in an s load of hours. we're talking 80+ hour weeks. I work 3rd shift taking calls from these people doing legal research and I get calls from CA when it's midnite there, from NY when it's 5AM, from the midwest at 3am, etc.

they are often stressed out b/c the partner they are working for is insistent that there must be a case that says what they want.

then after you put three / four plus miserable years in at the firm, if you decide to stay, you're often still looking at long hours and many of these firms are no longer offering partnership to their associates.

In short, it's a treadmill. I think W should do what she thinks will make her happier. There is something to be said for job security and if this is a permanent gov't type clerkship, especially if it's federal, there will be solid benefits, minimal risk of termination and a livable wage. If I was W I might do what she did. I can also see doing the higher wage thing for a few years, get out of debt, etc. But I don't think it's fair for H to demand it.

[Blarg]

A promise is a promise. If you can't trust a promise from the one you love, who can you trust, and what good are they? Hubby shouldn't be thought of as "demanding" for wanting the person he might trust and love most in the world to follow through with her years-long, expensive in terms of more than just money promise to him and not let him down. It's unfair to think that only one person in this situation has feelings.

[rothko]

unconditional support of one's spouse is neither expected or ideal. one ought to be supportive whenever warranted, reasonable and proper, but blindly standing behind the mate's decisions is an act of betrayal to each party involved as well as to the relationship itself.

to say that the husband in the op must accept his wife's decision makes her desires of greatest import without consideration to the many other factors that must be included in the discussion. the husband's feelings, desires, the financial realities, etc. must all be taken into account with an attempt at the best resolution to follow.

this really is a very personal situation, as in, not something to which sweeping generalizations can be applied. those involved need to examine all angles with love, care, and understanding. both perspectives are legitimate.

[Colt McCoy]

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If you are living with a compromised and sacrificial attitude, then wrong partner.

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Good luck finding a relationship where you never have to compromise or sacrifice. I'd argue there has probably never been such a relationship.

[Colt McCoy]

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So I'll clarify. I don't think marriage can ever be about love and money. It's not more your wife's responsibility to pay you than it is your boss's responsibility to sleep with you (God help you if your wife is your boss).

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I'm clearly not saying she owes him money. What I am saying is that he worked while she went to school. What he did by doing so was to make an investment in the couple's financial future. It's clear he viewed it that way, and I'd guess they probably discussed it.

We're not talking about a basketweaving class at the local community college that she's taking for fun. We're talking about 2-3 years and a buttload of money (I think the average is like $80k!) and him taking care of domestic things and not seeing her while she attends class, does homework, etc. This is similar to him taking the $80k and saying he's going to invest it in something for the couple's retirement, but instead she goes on an $80k shopping spree because that's what makes her happy.

By the way, I hope I'm not coming off as overly argumentative on this. I really do see the other side of the argument and think that above all, they really need to talk about this and explain why they each feel the way do about it.

Also, I'm still of the belief that she's making a choice based mostly on fear. Katy's description of her makes me think she really lacks self confidence and is taking the easy way out. Perhaps if they talked this through and he showed his support for her and confidence in her, he could show her that she can do the tougher job. It might lead to a lot of good things for her beyond just career issues.

[katyseagull]

Diebitter wrote:

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And Katy, while I know you have a good heart and probably will try not to, there's never, ever, EVER a good time to take sides in a couple's problems. Offer sympathy, comfort and kind words, but NEVER take sides or say a bad thing about one to the other. This can only lead to one, other or both resenting you in the end at some point.

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odellthurman wrote:
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No offense to the OP, but I believe there are serious communication problems in this marriage if the OP is so heavily involved in the discussion.


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Db and Odellthurman (that name cracks me up for some reason),

Let me assure you I am not heavily involved in their private discussions at all. I sit at my desk all day and people like to come and vent their problems to me. I’m like the resident bartender or something. I have on occasion told my friend to chill out, as he has a tendency to conduct himself like a really frantic, pissed off version of Chris Farley sometimes. Usually I just try to be really positive. Mostly I offer sympathetic smiles and kit-kat bars.


Look, I would never put down another person’s spouse or mate to them. You think I’m nuts? I’m only bringing it up on a message board because I think it is an interesting topic and like others have said, I can see both sides of this issue. I’m sympathetic to both parties. As I mentioned in my OP, both of these individuals are very nice people.

This is actually not the first time I’ve seen this situation. One of my friends from elementary school became a lawyer in California and then within 2 years flat out refused to work (she had a child but she also told me she didn’t like law). She and her husband actually filed bankruptcy. I thought it was strange. I kind of went hmm…that’s a little different. If I were her husband I’d probably be pissed! Course I never said that to her. I’m not an idiot you know.

Also, one of my sisters never got a job even though she graduated from an ivy league graduate school. She has never worked, ever. The question has come up if she owes my mom a little more effort since mom did put her through the first 4 years of college. Again, just find the whole topic interesting as I do all of life’s grey areas.

[katyseagull]

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By the way, I hope I'm not coming off as overly argumentative on this.

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Colt, I've enjoyed every one of your posts. You have made some strong points.



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Katy's description of her makes me think she really lacks self confidence and is taking the easy way out.

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Yes, she is very shy and non-assertive with everyone except, well, the husband.

[odellthurman]

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Mostly I offer sympathetic smiles and kit-kat bars.

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Kit-kats are delicious. Further discussion of their tastiness probably merits its own thread, if not a new forum on 2+2.

[piradical]

I am blessed to have such a relationship, and that is why I am taking such a radical attitude. Perhaps I am playing with semantics, as I will do things I'd rather not; but it is no sacrifice for me.
As I think about this problem some more, I see a similarity to a parent who happily puts a child through school expecting no return but the love of the moment. For our husband was there no return for him as it was going down; then why do it? Was it all based on expected future return?
Your point of view does seem more sensible, I just wonder if reason has any place in a loving relationship (a slight exaggeration only).

[madnak]

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I'm clearly not saying she owes him money. What I am saying is that he worked while she went to school. What he did by doing so was to make an investment in the couple's financial future. It's clear he viewed it that way, and I'd guess they probably discussed it.

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This wasn't my interpretation. I did miss the edit on Katy's post, so I was a bit confused. If they made an explicit agreement, that obviously changes things a bit. At the same time, I don't think such an agreement qualifies as a strict obligation on her part to go into corporate law.

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We're not talking about a basketweaving class at the local community college that she's taking for fun. We're talking about 2-3 years and a buttload of money (I think the average is like $80k!)

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Maybe it's the fact I plan on med school, but that just seems small to me. I understand that most people don't even make half that much in a year, but again this is a two-income couple (and she has a JD, she can't exactly be on the poverty line). They can't handle $80k in student loans?

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and him taking care of domestic things and not seeing her while she attends class,

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This seems particularly hollow. He wants her to be an ambitious corporate lawyer. That's part of the issue - it sounds like his desire is to see money, not her. From what I've heard 80+ hours per week is no exaggeration here.

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does homework, etc. This is similar to him taking the $80k and saying he's going to invest it in something for the couple's retirement, but instead she goes on an $80k shopping spree because that's what makes her happy.

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It sounds more like she put it into a long-term low-yield plan when he expected her to play the market.

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Also, I'm still of the belief that she's making a choice based mostly on fear. Katy's description of her makes me think she really lacks self confidence and is taking the easy way out. Perhaps if they talked this through and he showed his support for her and confidence in her, he could show her that she can do the tougher job. It might lead to a lot of good things for her beyond just career issues.

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That doesn't sound unlikely, but I don't think it changes the nature of the situation much.