Pokerstars Is Fixed

[Dave I]

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The weird thing is that these things should be extremely unlikely. As a 90% favorite you should win 90 out of 100 times. Why do I lose such situations so often?

Yesterday they dealt me five NL hands on Stars from which I played two: Lost with trips in the first one and lost with top pair + nut flush draw in the second one (all-in on the flop). Outcome: - $96!

In one day I lose like $500 on Party, PS and WPEX combined and all of that with huge hands. Not the usual bad beat stuff, it was more like an endless streak of cold decks which is much more expensive.

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This whole thread is insane. Is it "3-4 times as often"? Please show us real numbers. You should be able to tell for sure. If you can't there is your answer.

Guys, is it possible as site is rigged? Sure. But, nothing stated on the "for" side in this thread gives even a hint of evidence.

I keep hearing words like "my confidence", "I think", "should", "It seems like". These are all vague, give one bit of concrete evidence and maybe your case would hold more water.

90% and above favorites DO LOSE as they should. Nobody has shown they lose more than they are statistically supposed to.

We all have seen weird things, gone on long winning and losing streaks. How come nobody ever says "OMG it's rigged! My 10% favorites are winning 75% of the time!!", "I never lose!!"

All these it's rigged post always come after a bad downswing which can ALWAYS be explained by variance and bad play.

[MicroBob]

you remember the times you lose.

the times that you win you often don't get to see your opponent's hole-cards if you bet the river and they fold (or they muck at showdown and you don't check the HH).


Lots of times when people say they lost to a 10%'er they really lost to a 35%'er.


Lots of people try to justify their losses with claims that they can obviously tell that the cards just aren't 'realistic' compared to a hand-dealt game.

It is the paranoia that creeps into people's heads when they think they should be winning but they aren't COMBINED with the fact that they can't see actual cards be shuffled and dealt.


I played a tournament a couple nights ago in which I won decent-sized pots getting AA on back to back hands.
Awesome.
After the tournament was over I played a little no-limit and on the same table I hit a set of 4's twice within the same orbit to pull-in a couple decent sized-pots. One of these sets of 4's I got shown AA by my opponent.

When hands like these happen online it is pretty common for somebody to complain how stupid the cards run because things repeating themselves like that are just not realistic.
"LOL, this site sucks and the cards don't run right."


By the way, all these hands (back to back AA, and sets of 4's a few minutes apart at the same table) were all at a live game.

And there are plenty of people in the live-games who believe in requesting the dealer to change the deck after they get dealt 72o for 3 hands in a row. (or will change seats NOT because they want better position on a bad player...but because the cards they are getting in that seat ar particularly bad).


There are lots of reasons why a site could rig the games.

But to rig them in such a way that each individual player does nothing but lose or win at the same time at all 6 tables he is playing on would accomplish WHAT exactly??

And I agree with Zetack that IF a site were going to rig the games they would want to do it in a way that would NOT be detected by the player.


Those who say that they can 'just tell' that the cards are not running the way they should are usually (always) trying to justify their losses or bad play.


Most people do not play poker particularly well.
Most of these people CLAIM that they are in the minority that actually know how to play well.

[Xellos]

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I could say a lot more and go into much more detail

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Please don't.

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[CallMeIshmael]

Ooey, gooey, rich and chewy inside
Golden flakey, tender cakey outside!
Wrap the inside in the outside, is it good?

Darn tootin!

Do the fig, fig, newton!

[cardcounter0]

Go to a casino and play live. If you think Pokerstars is bad, you will come away from casino play screaming ...

ZOMG!!! B&M IZ SOOO RIGGED!!!!1!!one1!.

[bqtrain]

This reminds me of when my friends would play 4 player, same team Madden football, and we'd have a lead but then the computer would rig the game in the fourth quarter so it would make some unbelievable plays to win the game and we titled this phenomenon "bukkake." Does anyone here think Poker Stars might be working with EA sports to bring this phenomenon over to poker? I say we get Carl Monday on the case. If he can bust a genius like The Ohio State University's own Mike Cooper, he'll get to the bottom of the poker-bukakee phenomenon. Bad beats like flopping top two pair and losing to a straight draw (check out this guy's blog titled "My White Boy Pain" linked to in chapter 3) just shouldn't happen.

[Zetack]

Sigh.

As far as I can tell your evidence that stars is rigged is that you have hot and cold streaks, you have "familiar" flops and can sense the cards that are coming, and on certain hands when you're a big favorite (you gave two examples where your opponent had gutshot straight draws) you "can be certain" or you can "bet your ass" the card is hitting.

Ok. (1) Hot and cold streaks. Postulate, if you will, a site that is completely non-rigged with an honest rng. Statistics would tell us that you would actually expect to see a bunch of hot and cold streaks. It would be suspicious if you didn't.

2. The flop are familiar. If you see tens of thousands of hands, a lot of flops are gonna trigger that deja-vu feeling. Although there are many thousands of combinations of cards, there are actually only a handful of types of flops. See enough of em, they all start to look familiar.

2(a) Thus you can sense what's coming. Um....I doubt it. If you note down for me precisely what you sense coming for the next six months and then record what actually came, well then we can talk. [and no, "I sensed it was coming a seven to make his straight and it came an eight (see so close) and made his two pair to beat me! OMG!!!!] doesn't count as a hit.]

3. You have a big favorit hand and the guy has to hit his gutshot or whatever to win. Bet your ass all you want, if you actually track this, I suspect you will be very surprised in how off your perception is from reality.


Ok, poker could be rigged. I don't beleive Stars is, but its at least conceptually possible. However, if it is (1) I doubt they'd do it in the ways you describe and (2) You certainly are not capable of detecting it in the ways you describe.

Look, we have pattern recognition "software" in our brains. Its been an incredibly important tool for our survival as a species. The problem is, its so important to us, that the software works to find patterns even when there are none.

On the other hand, if you're simply a troll, I want my fifteen minutes back, pond scum.

--Zetack

[Pokerlicious]

tl;dr

Didn't know Stars was broken.

[Gambit1]

In ontario there was something like this with scratch cards. Wasn't rigged as in you weren't able to win but you could determine the winning cards thru the serial numbers on the cards.

My friend had a convience store back when we found about this and what'd we do is look for the winning cards even the small ones and keep em for ourselves and start feeding the customers the non-winning ones.

My point is that it could very well be rigged but the more rigged it is the more they'll hide it.

[JustChip]

pokerstars is not fixed. no question