Pregnant GF

[kerowo]

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Also, no one ever points out that all of the people who favor abortion, were never aborted.

Stupid? Oversimplified? Perhaps... but a fact nonetheless.

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Okay. I gave you the benefit of the doubt before, but this is possibly the most retarded thing I've ever heard.

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I defy you to explain why pointing out the fact that none of the 1.3 million people in the US who are aborted each year are allowed to plead their case is "retarded".

Let me ask you this. When do you consider abortion wrong?

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Because none of the fetuses that were not aborted got to plead their cases either.

Perhaps if you could try and argue this without making someone a villain or appealing directly to emotion you wouldn't be considered a giant douche.

[Inso0]

Kerowo, when do you consider abortion a violation of whatever moral code you abide by?

[Blarg]

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Blarg, I don't judge you or the OP if they think abortion is ok. I obviously don't agree with you. But I also haven't directly attacked either of you for it.

Nor am I naive enough to think I can change your minds. But I have nothing to lose by at least voicing my opinion.

You're trying way too hard to be combatitive with me.

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Only because I think you were being unfairly combative to the OP and negating any possible chance that he may have morality of his own and be a good person. This seems founded on the basis of his ideas perhaps being different than yours -- or the mere possibility that they are. This strikes me as of the essence of unfairness. And, in the context of both a forum in general and in particular a thread wherein the OP is confessing his guts out and asking for feedback, it strikes me as unnecessarily combative. OP is faced with hard questions, and attacking him when he's asking for help, or implying he's some sort of dirtbag or whatever, seems wrong. And saying he only has one option, when the truth is he has several, seems to be less than on the level.

Frankly, I don't think anyone should make someone else unduly lock down his clear thinking on such important subjects by directing condemnation at him or telling him he's trapped into only one way of thinking or being -- especially when he's not. The truth is, he just has options that some like better than others. There really is probably a better, more honest way to do things than jumping all over the OP.

I don't see why it is so acceptable or loving or whatever to pile on the hate on one set of choices. Especially since it is not true that only rosy things happen if one path is chosen and only every sort of awfulness imaginable occurs if the other path is taken. Piling on hate isn't that cool in the first place, but at least painstaking care should be taken to make sure there isn't a hair out of place with regard to honesty and full consideration of the circumstances if one does. Instead, we are getting purposely tilted, black and white pictures that just aren't honest at all, and therefore seem to me patently far less than caring.

[kerowo]

Probably some time into the 3rd tri.

edited to add
I don't know what the exact time is but I don't think that is as important as having them available to women who want them. I definately am not in the "from conception" camp.

[Inso0]

Blarg, when do you consider abortion to be a violation of your chosen moral code?

[Blarg]

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Also, no one ever points out that all of the people who favor abortion, were never aborted.

Stupid? Oversimplified? Perhaps... but a fact nonetheless.

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Okay. I gave you the benefit of the doubt before, but this is possibly the most retarded thing I've ever heard.

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Got to agree here. This is just silliness.

Inso, please stop with the slogans and terrible comparisons. They don't give any traction for thought because they're not real thinking. If we just slung thinking of this order back and forth at each other, we might as well be flinging poo like baboons.

[Inso0]

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Probably some time into the 3rd tri.

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What about 5 months into the pregnancy?

[kerowo]

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Probably some time into the 3rd tri.

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What about 5 months into the pregnancy?

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Check the edit on my post, but if I understand trimesters correctly 5 months isn't in the 3rd one. Make your point about fetuses being viable at the point of conception and lets move on.

[Jbrochu]

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Don't tell me that because you have a religious belief, that's supposed to necessarily be sufficient for anyone but yourself.

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I believe you can be opposed to abortion without being religious. I'm for the most part against abortion and it has nothing at all to do with religion.

[Blarg]

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Blarg, when do you consider abortion to be a violation of your chosen moral code?

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I'm not exactly sure. Probably well into the third trimester, but I'm not sure even then. Frankly, the idea of telling a woman she cannot have an abortion if she wants to seems staggeringly inappropriate to me and an absolute violation of her most fundamental rights and privacy.

Especially if the proponent of forced birth is not willing to support the baby in full him/herself after the mother is forced to have it. If abortion were made illegal, I think it could only morally be done in some kind of a massive welfare or totalitarian state that in one way or another guaranteed children forced to be born would not chance a life of neglect or drastically diminished horizons. And I don't think anyone is ready for that kind of state at this point; I'm not, anyway.

Basically, I think that people should mind their own business, and that morality questions like these are individual decisions. I just don't think government should get involved.