please tell your opinion of this email from FullTilt i received

[2461Badugi]

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This was actually an email from Full Tilt support and Ive played about over 150 thousand hands online and I lose at about a 60-70% rate when i get my money in good after the flop.

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Do all sites have an FGators?

[oddsock]

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Ive played about over 150 thousand hands online and I lose at about a 60-70% rate when i get my money in good after the flop.

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What you are saying is the equivalent of flipping a fair coin and losing 2 out of 3 of them over a reasonable number of times. It can never happen.

Prove the above and you have grounds for rigging.

[ILuvRiver]

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Ive played about over 150 thousand hands online and I lose at about a 60-70% rate when i get my money in good after the flop.

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Yea, right, of course you do. Please please please prove this. I'd love to see your supporting evidence. This simply WOULD NOT HAPPEN! (unless you are calling with moronic hands).

[MiltonFriedman]

I read the email you posted and, before I got to the whining post-script, thought you did so because of how well your bad beat complaint was handled.

Fish DO play because sometimes they suck out and can run well for the short run.

Unless you have an incredible sample of hands and analysis, you are telling another "bad beat story".

FTP support took the compassionate route of listening, because they do want your business.

I'll be more blunt, if you truly lose 60& or 70% of the time you put all your money in post flop, you are not playing well. Variance has little to do with what you seem to be doing poorly. It is much more likely that when your money goes in, it is nowhere near as "good" as you believe.

[MiltonFriedman]

You might do better by reading a couple of books sold on this site.

[MicroBob]

my opinion of the e-mail as requested by the OP:

1. their condescending use of "good players, such as yourself" probably needs to be changed. But I guess almost all of the e-mail is going to obviously try to appease the morons who think it's the fault of the site that the cards are somehow not running 'normal' like they do live, etc etc.

2. Looks like a pretty decent e-mail from their support to me. Although evidently they need to simplify the language even more than they already do so that even the dumbest of the dumb can understand. This is clearly the standard e-mail they constructed ahead of time to try to explain to the constant complainers who say "OMGZZ!! these cards aren't the same" and it seems fine to me but obviously some players who think the site is out to get him or that the cards just "aren't normal" are going to read something into it that isn't there at all.

Based on the OP's reaction to the e-mail and supposedly that other people agree with him that there is something dastardly in there I'm thinking perhaps FT and Stars and other sites trying to actually be polite while explaining this stuff should just go the Kyleb route and respond, "Only morons think the cards somehow run differently just for them. Have a nice day."

That's probably not such a great idea though unfortunately.
I'm sure these decently written form e-mails they send to the complainers actually do make at least partial sense to SOME of their recipients.

[JackCase]

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To me, this says that if your hand should have an 80% chance of winning( 80% being the expected rate) and in these situations I am winning at a 50-60% rate then that explains why.

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Every person who ever came on these forums and claimed that a site was rigged has said the same thing. And they, like you, had no data to back up their claim.

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And i am losing to ridiculous calls that have no business being in the hand after the post flop bet and hit runner runner constantly or 4 or less outers.

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As FTP pointed out, these people lose in the long run. That's what makes poker profitable for the minority of good players.

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This to me says that Full Tilt is playing with the odds to give bad play wins that they shouldn't receive to keep them playing thus making Full Tilt more money. And playing with the math, in other words adjusting the odds, says that the site is rigged.

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The letter doesn't say that they are playing with the odds. It says that some players winning against the odds is normal and expected.

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Please tell me your opinion of this email.

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My opinion of the email is that it is correct and logical.

My opinion of your post is that you don't understand variance, that you do not understand poker, and that you are not a very good player. And that you have significant problems of self-denial about your abilities.

Also, if you are right and the rest of the world is wrong, why do you continue to play at a site where you are so convinced that you are being cheated?

[jafeather]

Stoker, huh? Like to stoke a fire?

Nice gimmick account.

I assume this will be locked very soon, so in before lock.

[soulvamp]

At least you got an e-mail from FTP. I still haven't been able to figure out how to get any more than an autoresponse from them that tells me they'll answer my question when they get around to it.

[_Towelie_]

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Please feel free to share your bad beats but what is your opinion on the email.

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Full Tilt's response was quite level-headed considering the utter absurdity of your accusation. Unless of course you actually have played through a substantive sample and can prove that you're not just hitting the outer rim of variance.