Simple KK 4-betting Question

[thedustbustr]

id check raise the flop (or just check call)

[ajmargarine]

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id check raise the flop (or just check call)

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No way. Not after I 4-bet it. Lead/push is the only play IMO.

[tubasteve]

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though if UTG comes along, then the chances of an A flopping are greatly diminished

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could you please elaborate. i do not understand this what so ever.

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AIUI if UTG tags along it's quite likely he holds an Ace and so there is less chance that an Ace hits the flop if there are only 3 left in the deck.

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i disagree with this statement a lot and think people ranges are heavily skewed towards pocketpairs when they put a lot of $ in preflop rather than Ax

[bilbo-san]

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id check raise the flop (or just check call)

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No way. Not after I 4-bet it. Lead/push is the only play IMO.

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Why? Because you would push AK? Because you are protecting against an A?

TBH I doubt it matters much. Villain is likely good enough to know that he wasn't calling for set value, so I doubt QQ folds (if he calls preflop with it).

[SABR42]

I don't ever call here.

I make it $35 to go, and try to get it all-in. I think just shoving is also ok.

By flat-calling, UTG will call everytime, getting great odds and closing the action.

I DO NOT want to lose my stack to UTG's 77 (or whatever) because I let him hang around and flop a set on what looked liked a harmless flop.

[thedustbustr]

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id check raise the flop (or just check call)

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No way. Not after I 4-bet it. Lead/push is the only play IMO.

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someone might have got to it before me but -

if its AA vs KK, the monies are going in no matter what, we know that. The thing is it's so obvious that we have an overpair that we are relying on his ability to stack off with TT+ for our flop shove to be good. which is why if we check, he can say "OMFG AK" and shove which we snap call.

especially if he is solid - and capable of folding QQ on the flop - we can at least try to check it down to the river and "OMG BLUFF W AK" . i think it's the only way we can get any more money in, unless its a cooler for one of us.

why do you disagree?

fwiw, im hardly ever in this situation bc im in the "i almost never fourbet" camp.

[SABR42]

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fwiw, im hardly ever in this situation bc im in the "i almost never fourbet" camp.

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I'm usually in this camp too, but not when the pot is multi-way.

Announcing that you have a huge hand is not as bad as potentially getting stacked by a hand that never should have been allowed to see a flop, IMO.