ZeeJustin the next to get caught multi accounting Party MTTs

[RFJ]

Understand this..They only confiscated what was left in his account. They couldn't make him return all the money he already cashed out during the process of his cheating..Which is probably above the 100k that they confiscated. What penalties did he really face!! Except being banned from the sites. That's not even a slap on the wrist! He's keeping all his previous winnings. I think some think it's a small amount, but in a nutshell his previous winnings probably a whole lot more than people think. He's still driving his fancy car. A car that's more expensive than yours!! You two are probably friend or family trying to defend someone who has not learned a lesson from what has transpired here. He should consider himself lucky. If these games were actually regulated and *legal*. He would be facing harsher consequences. Consider possible jail time even for his *young age* and plus most likely he would have to work his ass off to pay off the people he ripped off. He would definitely not be keeping his previous winnings. If these sites had some legality in the US they would be seizing his bank accounts as well as his assets. What is considered grand theft $5k? I consider that jail time.

Don't tell me what kind of harsh punishment it is. I logged many hours at real casinos.. I've seen people get banned from casinos for verbal abuse!! I repeat verbal abuse! Not physical!

[Indiana]

I understand dude. What he did was wrong. I was just saying that he made a mistake, should be punished, but shouldnt see his life ruined at such a young age. I am very disappointed, however, that he has not come out with a formal apology after all this time. His absence is wrong and he should be very transparent at this point.

Whats he got to lose?

Indy

[MikeGuz]

Iknow Mike O'Malley he was a card room manager in Arizona a few years ago - I don't think ha'd be naming the player however since he is in a foreign country perhaps he did.

I have thought for a long time there was cheating going on in the big on line sites I have this fear of a dozen guys in South Korea playing in the same room.

[RFJ]

See that's where i don't see your point...you say punish him but don't ruin his life? How does banning his ass ruin his freaking life? He wasn't even punished..It's not like he was even banned from a live casino..which I think he should...Look at his freakin commments that he's not the cheater, but PP is the cheater..That's because he has never been punished for doing wrong..He doesn't even think what he did is wrong. Like a freaking baby that's spoiled and had it his way all his life. So he thinks he can get away with anything. Let him spend a couple of nights in jail and become someones freaking B**** then tell me if he won't have second thoughts and regrets.Until then he will be the same arrogant ass...Until then he will cheat and steal people out of money and still have a grin and smile on his face and say F*** nothing u can do about it!! H*LL if I was just going get some comment like "oh you have to return the money. It's ok you can keep the 100k from the previous robberies, just return what you have in your hand now and we'd be even. I think 99% of the people on earth would go to bank right now!! There is a reason why we put people in jail. To show there are consequences to stealing. To prevent them from doing it again! I doubt he's feeling any pain.

If he had any type of remorse he would be returning all the money he had cashed out. "Can't help what he already spent, but the rest he has in his bank account he should forfeit it willingly give it up" He shouldn't be saying things like where's my new car. PP stole my money and now I can't get my new car. I can't even believe at he still wants his affiliate money. I don't know how many sign ups he had. But i'm pretty sure it was few until he was getting the recognition of being a good player! I bet after that he had mass sign ups!! Oh and not to mention... All those $$$ he accrued using multiple sign ups!! Probably got his friends under multiple sign ups too. So i'm not seeing your point of view.

Like i have said before I recognize most of the alias he used because I have sat on his tables many times. If I have lost even a single opportunity for the 25k 15k 10k prizes do to his underhanded plays. Then I'd say yes I've lost a lot. I know i'm a good solid player,(advanced), but without a big bankroll I don't play some of the bigger games that I could. One of those wins could have boosted me to higher buy ins. Giving me the opportunity to make even bigger money. Instead it's a much slower process because I've been playing the wrong game sittin on the wrong table. Having multiple entries to one tournament is a huge advantage. Especially if u get can even one opportunity to sit at the same table. There is a saying you here from the pros all the time. "Yeah you need to go all in on coin flips many times in a tournament." If you get lucky you will win most of them, but if your unlucky one flip will end your tournament life! This is the reality of tourmanents. That is why you need to get lucky in tournaments. And if you can increase your chances of busting out even once..It's a huge positive. You also here pros say yeah I knew he was a new kid and 50k is a lot to him. That's why I raised with the 5 9 because i knew the next hand he would be in the money. There is no way he could call when he was one spot away even if he had KK. That's why I could make that move because I am shooting for first I could afford a beat, and I know to that kid 50k is a lot and he would be happy to get the 50k than bust out trying to take first!! Guess what though if the kid was sitting a two tables or even more great what an easy call. Takes the psychology out of poker! I can take a chance here because I have 8 other lives no one knows about.

One thing i'd like to add. Many of the pros started off as good players. Most became great after they had the bankroll to back them up. If they didn't get the one lucky break on a tourmanent to win big money. They wouldn't have had the 2nd and 3rd opportunity to win more money. I'm not saying they weren't good players because many of them came up from the cash game formats, but you and I both know that tournament and cash is a little different style of play.

[KlumsySmurf]

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I've been reading some post and I just love how some idiot defend someone like ZeeJustin. If you're the one getting cheated you wouldn't be defending him. You'd be asking for your money. I used to play a lot of step higher games and ZeeJustin , IBLUFFUOUT69, and mehsab are all familiar names to me. After giving up because of many many failed attempts. I stop playing those games because I felt it was rigged. I didn't know how people were making some donkey plays and still come out on top on the leader boards. I followed some of them around and looked at some of the hands they tried to steal with. Some rediculous hands. Recently about a month ago I started playing the step games again. For about 2 weeks now I see fewer and fewer people playing these games..I didn't know the reason till now!! For people that don't know what a step game is. It's 1st or nothing. That's why it's so hard. Back then 1st place was 25k for step 5.

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Ummmm RFJ, he didn't multi sng's, just multis. And pushing with crap is how you win sngs, perhaps you should read up on the sng forum some before you try these again [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

[KlumsySmurf]

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Did you even think as you were typing?


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Actually I was completely smashed after a night out with friends, so I wasn't in the clearest state of mind. That being said, I still think killing baby penguins is much worse, on the grand scale of cheating at poker multi accounting mtt's without the intention of colluding rates far below many other forms of cheating imo. From what I've read on these and other boards a lot of those who did multi-account mtt's have stopped doing it as the risk of getting caught is not worth the small edge it provides, and a few were naive enough not to realize that it was actually cheating and now realize their mistake.

He definately owes an apology to the poker community, but to think that this should ruin his whole poker career is just stupid. The punishment needs to fit the crime, and in this case I believe it has.

[Mempho]

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Did you even think as you were typing?


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That being said, I still think killing baby penguins is much worse

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Tree hugger.

[RFJ]

I wouldn't remember his alias if I didn't play him!! 3 of his id's I remember clearly and the 4th moderately!! Those were the games I played back then and I remember his names clearly..

Don't even say that he didn't play the multi step higher or sngs..do a google search you'll see his name posted. He even has a post there where he states he won the multi step higher 5!! In his own post!! I just did a google search and as quickly the first hit, this came up!! His own bragging!!

ZEEJustin.com - Justin Bonomo, Professional Poker PlayerThen I saw one of Parties Step 5 Higher SNGs with 8 people in it. ... The rest of the SNG was rather uneventful, except for the fact that I won. ...
www.zeejustin.com/journal.php?journal_id=34 - Similar pages

Yes and I do know that you have to try to steal on sngs, but it's a lot easier if your getting more than your share of odds. If someone is cheating. They are not stack dumping like most people think. Yes, in the course of time if the cards didn't come they may have to. But think about it!! Play solid get down to three players. One opponent and two Justins. Steal your opponents blinds especially when it's high! Steal only the opponents blind yes you may get called but you know any hand is only a 2/3 dog. So you know your getting odds. And if you get lucky he's going to be out. Then if by chance one Justin gets knocked out. He'll get another chance!! While the legitimate player is thinking everything is legit and doesn't make the call or can't make the call because the other Justin might call! Don't even tell me about pot odds...I know all that. The reason these step higher games were hard was because it was 1st or nothing till the 4th level.

And yes they only talk about mtt only because someone turned him in and was caught with the mtt. It's not because he only played the mtt. And the fact that he was only caught playing the mtt. That's just nonsense. If PP found him cheating on the sng they are not going to make a huge public spectacle out of it especially when they can't prosecute because of juristiction. It will just make the legitimate players more furious!! Look at the step higher games. Until recently people filled the games. I know that the step higher level 4 filled up at least once a day until recently. Most likely because of this scandal. What do they hope to gain except lose more business if they know people are getting away with it and they can't do nothing about it. Yes, it'd be great if the could prosecute in the US. Then you'd probably see headlines like. "Yes, Justin was caught cheating the mtt and sngs as well as the step games. Yes, he is under investigation and we will be looking into how many people were cheated, and will be returning $$$ to the legitimate players by seizing his assets!" Until they can get a headline out like that they are going to down play the whole thing. You really think they are going to advertise something like this " Yes, he was caught cheating the mtt, sng, and the higher games. But since we cannot prosecute him we will only confiscate what's left in his account. The $$$ he won cheating players on the sng, step higher games, and previous mtt earnings. Well he gets to keep it." Yes, that will boast a lot of confidence in the site. Use some common sense.

Also unless there is a true investigation there is no way to tell if he used other ips. He may have had a set of id's under one ip and another set of id's he used on a different ip. The reason? Hmm... Let's see...Until recently people could not get broadband connection inexpensively. And I don't know where he lives, but I don't even think you can get a dual connections in a residental area at most places. Of course you could do it. Just how much $$$ do you want to fork over to do it? Think of how expensive it was even a year ago. To get dual access maybe he went to the business district got an office and made some kind of business connection. Or maybe he got a couple of satelite dishes to do it. Did they even have a internet on satelite dishes a year ago? I don't know. It was probably expensive though.. All extra expenses..Yes even getting two ips is expensive, but for all 6-12 alias' that will cost a quite of bit of fortune. For the sngs he probably used the dual id's to hide his ips, but for the mtt he probably thought it wouldn't get noticed because they normally wouldn't get set up in the same table. And even if they did it's not like the every day player is going to know. Even PP didn't put in an investigation till someone told them.

Some people think that having a 6 alias is one mtt doesn't give him a huge advantage. When in fact it does. Even if he doesn't get the opportunity to sit on the same table to do some type of collusion activity. Let's simpify this to a tournament of 600 players. While everyone is getting 1/600 odds he's getting 1/100 odds of winning. I'd say that's a significant advantage especially if all the money is in the top spots.

Let's put this in another perspective. Let's say he's getting 6 entries. The same amount of players on the mtt 600. So he's getting 1/100. The only thing is that he can't be in the game at the same time. He can re-enter only once he gets knocked out with only 1000 chips. So 1 hour goes by he gets knocked off. He buys in again. Maybe another hour get knocked off. and so on and so forth. By the time he gets to the 6th entry. The blinds are already 6000. He came in 1000 chips next blind he's commited no matter what..What has changed? Time relative to the blinds. He is still getting his 6 entries, but tell me would u take this kind of offer? I know that i wouldn't. This is the nature of tourmaments accumlation of chips relative to the blinds. Any time I can see more cards and allow myself to get lucky either by allowing myself to catch great cards or outdraws. I'm way ahead of everyone else.

[parappa]

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I wouldn't remember his alias if I didn't play him!! 3 of his id's I remember clearly and the 4th moderately!! Those were the games I played back then and I remember his names clearly..

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So, do you have poker tracker records of more than one of his names sitting at the same STT or Step Tournament? Because if you do, everyone that is currently attacking you would think that that was very interesting. Hand numbers, tournament numbers, anything like that.

Otherwise, the point that has been repeatedly made to you is that ZJ claimed he only multi-accounted in MTTs, and if that is true, it doesn't matter how much of an advantage you get in STTs, Step tournaments, or cash games, because he says he didn't do it, Pokerstars for their part seems to agree, and no one has any evidence that he did.

Again, if you have some hand #s or tournament #s that prove otherwise, everyone would love to see it as it would help this thread to set the posts record. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[RFJ]

Oh yeah I like to make one thing clear...I meant to say accumlation of chips relative to the blinds and time. Anyways all the legit players are getting 1/600 odds to get a top prize of 100k. While he's getting 1/100 odds to get get a top prize of 100k. Certainly the $$$ didn't change, his odds certainly did. I bet everyone here would love to hear something from the tournament director like "everyone we're going to get rid of 500 players in this 600 player tournament, but we're still giving out the prize guaranteed for 600 players" If I can find a tournament like this i'd be the first one to say where do I sign up! If he was actually playing a 100 player tournament like his odds dicates he would be winning 16,666 instead of the 100k. A huge difference.