ZeeJustin the next to get caught multi accounting Party MTTs

[LozColbert]

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2. His big tournament win on PokerStars was legitimate (we checked it carefully). The amount of money that we ascribed to illicit play was relatively small (less than $5K), and we confiscated that entire amount. We permitted him to cash out the balance over that.

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Boo!

[betadecay]

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I wonder how Zee's previous excuses in his apology about Party apply here:

1. Pokerstars does not have a software bug where you can just keep clicking on the icon to open up multiple accounts. He had to go through some considerable trouble to multi-account there (Virtual machine or registry hack or something?)

2. Will he again claim he did something that is not against Stars TOS just like its not against Party's? (Even though it clearly is against both).

3. Will he blame this on Stars like he blamed the other banning on Party?

4. Will he claim that he had extra accounts at Stars just to change his name?


I think that this further proves the points that El Diablo has made throughout this thread. It is now obvious that this kid did a lot more than he admitted to in his "apology." I think its very likely that he not only put six horses in his races, but that his six horses helped each other win the race when they were at the same table.

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Also, should we run for the hills before stars confiscates all of our money for everyone who gets rakeback there as well?

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It is not possible to get rakeback at stars, as they do not have a revenue-sharing affiliate program.

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Yes, that was the joke.

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LOL, i bet that joke got him slammed with PM's.

[LozColbert]

Seriously, Lee, I think you should have thought about the situation with his money further before allowing him to cash it out. I'd at least place a hold and think about it for a week.

[betadecay]

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my $.02 for ZeeJustin and the board

ZeeJustin,

The sun comes up. You made a mistake and I hope you come out OK through it all. I've been in your shoes in some ways and it sucks. But, I hope you can make the best of the situation. I'm not saying it will be a positive event. I doubt it will be. Just make the best of what has happened, because that is all you can do.

I made a terrible mistake when I was 19, which I've mentioned a few times in the forum before. I was heavy into the drug scene. Most people I knew were 'doing it.' No one was getting in trouble for it. I, and my acquaintences, didn't think much trouble would result if we did get caught. No one was being hurt by what we were doing. Well....

I got caught. I was breaking the law. I thought then, and still think, that the laws are/were stupid. However, that gives me no right to not obide by those laws.

It turned out to be a big deal. Through months of legal battles/negotiations, I was fortunate enough to receive only a 3 years sentence in the department of corrections for a possession charge. (The time served was much less as I was a first-time, non-violent offender who received good-time credit though I did violate prison rules... yeah, nothing about prison is logical.)

At the time, I was studying to become a high school teacher. Good luck with that. Decisions at 19 can bar one permanently from a chosen field. I moved into a different field when I tried to put my life back on track. I earned numerous degrees from a major university in a prestigious program (one which is consistently rated as tops in the country), but I still could not find employment. Once a felon, always a felon. Luckily, poker exists and I was still able to find my niche and make a few dollars.

Today, I live a different, but still very good life. Many avenues were blocked, but, luckily, this is a land of opportunity.

ZeeJustin, I hope you can see some parallels. You're 19 and it's both every bit as important and not nearly as important as you think. You broke the rules, whether you think they are 'right' or not. This will take months to sort out and will always be crawling somewhere around in your mind. Try to make the best of it. Don't let it bring you down. Remember, most people that achieve great things go through a few monumental failures. A lapse of judgment at 19, though wrong, is not that bad if you learn from it.

I've always respected your posts here on 2p2 and you have a great mind for this game. I'm not a fan of your cheating.

I wish you luck in wherever you go and whatever you do.

Peace

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This is one of the best posts in this mess of a thread.

[PartyGirlUK]

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The amount of money that we ascribed to illicit play was relatively small (less than $5K), and we confiscated that entire amount. We permitted him to cash out the balance over that.


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Lee,

this is a very bad policy. Let me explain why. It does not provide a disincentive to cheat. Someone can cheat like Justin did, and they know that even if they get caught they will only lose the amount the stole. If they don't get caught then their theft is profitable. Hence, it is impossible for them to lose by cheating. Furthermore, unless you can 100% guarantee catching all cheaters, then cheating is +EV under your system.

Disappointed,

Dean

[ClearlyCorrect]

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The amount of money that we ascribed to illicit play was relatively small (less than $5K), and we confiscated that entire amount. We permitted him to cash out the balance over that.


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Lee,

this is a very bad policy. Let me explain why. It does not provide a disincentive to cheat. Someone can cheat like Justin did, and they know that even if they get caught they will only lose the amount the stole. If they don't get caught then their theft is profitable. Hence, it is impossible for them to lose by cheating. Furthermore, unless you can 100% guarantee catching all cheaters, then cheating is +EV under your system.

Disappointed,

Dean

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[BlackRain]

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The amount of money that we ascribed to illicit play was relatively small (less than $5K), and we confiscated that entire amount. We permitted him to cash out the balance over that.


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Lee,

this is a very bad policy. Let me explain why. It does not provide a disincentive to cheat. Someone can cheat like Justin did, and they know that even if they get caught they will only lose the amount the stole. If they don't get caught then their theft is profitable. Hence, it is impossible for them to lose by cheating. Furthermore, unless you can 100% guarantee catching all cheaters, then cheating is +EV under your system.

Disappointed,

Dean

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Agree completely.

[Jeremy517]

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The amount of money that we ascribed to illicit play was relatively small (less than $5K), and we confiscated that entire amount. We permitted him to cash out the balance over that.


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Lee,

this is a very bad policy. Let me explain why. It does not provide a disincentive to cheat. Someone can cheat like Justin did, and they know that even if they get caught they will only lose the amount the stole. If they don't get caught then their theft is profitable. Hence, it is impossible for them to lose by cheating. Furthermore, unless you can 100% guarantee catching all cheaters, then cheating is +EV under your system.

Disappointed,

Dean

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Agreed. His punishment is not much of a deterrant.

[junglewarfare]

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The amount of money that we ascribed to illicit play was relatively small (less than $5K), and we confiscated that entire amount. We permitted him to cash out the balance over that.


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Lee,

this is a very bad policy. Let me explain why. It does not provide a disincentive to cheat. Someone can cheat like Justin did, and they know that even if they get caught they will only lose the amount the stole. If they don't get caught then their theft is profitable. Hence, it is impossible for them to lose by cheating. Furthermore, unless you can 100% guarantee catching all cheaters, then cheating is +EV under your system.

Disappointed,

Dean

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Agree completely. Pokerstars [censored] this up. I am still kind of wondering why they didn't do more about this when el capitan or whatever did it. Didn't Berkowitz play on other people's accounts and win money on them? Shouldn't they have um, done something about that?

[Phil153]

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2. His big tournament win on PokerStars was legitimate (we checked it carefully). The amount of money that we ascribed to illicit play was relatively small (less than $5K), and we confiscated that entire amount. We permitted him to cash out the balance over that.


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Hi Lee,

Can you go into more detail on this "illicit play?" Was it multi-accounting or something else? Also, why would you go to the trouble of determining which amount of ZJ's account was attributable to "illicit play?" Are you saying that I can come onto your site and cheat and the only thing I will have to worry about is losing whatever I cheated people out of? That doesn't seem like such a bad deal for a cheater. Especially if the cheater is a multi-accounter and will just go open an account in another person's name anyway.

I think you should re-think your confiscatin policy in regards to cheaters. If I'm a cheater, I would love to play on your site and hate to play on Party's.

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