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#11
04-19-2006, 04:51 PM
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Re: Why aren\'t setup men paid better?
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[ QUOTE ] There really isn't much difference between a good setup man and a good closer. /captain obvious I wouldn't sign any one-inning reliever to a large or long term contract at typical free agent prices. Closers are paid so much because most GMs don't realize any of this. p.s. jim hendry sucks. [/ QUOTE ] The Red Sox tried this a few years ago. Didn't work out so well. [/ QUOTE ] Grady. Little. edit to add that I will never understand why people are so opposed to the idea of using your best RP in the most important situations and with the best matchups. It's not like 9th inning only relievers are a long and storied part of baseball tradition. 
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#14
04-19-2006, 05:20 PM
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Re: Why aren\'t setup men paid better?
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Anybody can pitch in relief. It takes a Special Player to close. Sincerely, Some Talking Head or Beat Writer [/ QUOTE ] Very nice.
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#16
04-19-2006, 05:58 PM
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Re: Why aren\'t setup men paid better?
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Anybody can and should throw 190 pitches per game every three days. Sincerely, Dusty Baker, Jim Leyland, and Jimy Williams [/ QUOTE ]
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#18
04-19-2006, 06:08 PM
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Re: Why aren\'t setup men paid better?
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[ QUOTE ] The truth is the vast majority people that can get outs in the 7th inning can get outs in the 9th inning [/ QUOTE ] Not necessarily true. [/ QUOTE ] I think that there's ample evidence to prove that this is true. I think there's also a bit of evidence to prove that it isn't always true. Still, the ability to protect a 3-run lead in the ninth is vastly overrated.
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#19
04-19-2006, 06:17 PM
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Re: Why aren\'t setup men paid better?
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I think that there's ample evidence to prove that this is true. I think there's also a bit of evidence to prove that it isn't always true. Still, the ability to protect a 3-run lead in the ninth is vastly overrated. [/ QUOTE ] Jack, I agree with you that protecting a 3-run lead is overrated and my comment, "not necessarily true," was said b/c of your exact comment...that there is a little bit of grey area there. With this said, there isn't a whole lot of grey area when discussing the difference between a lefty mid-eighties specialty reliever and a lights out closer preserving a 1 run lead in the ninth. The 9th inning is a completely different game than the 6th and 7th. In the middle innings if the leadoff hitter singles you may not see the next guy bunt him into scoring position as the case always is in the 9th. You need the overpowering stuff, the strikeout potential b/c of these situations. I think closers are overpaid and am not defending that, but I know for a fact that closing out a 1 run game in the ninth and being a specialty reliever in the middle innings are two different worlds...that is fact. This is a mentality issue and not a numbers issue.
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#20
04-19-2006, 06:35 PM
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Re: Why aren\'t setup men paid better?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] The truth is the vast majority people that can get outs in the 7th inning can get outs in the 9th inning [/ QUOTE ] Not necessarily true. [/ QUOTE ] I want to clarify that I said vast majority because there have been cases (LaTroy Hawkins) of guys that are good setup men but do poorly as a closer. Relievers with great stuff eventually find themselves as closers. Guys like Lidge and Rivera were setup guys until they became closers. They are excellent at both because they have filthy stuff, not because of a closer mentality. I don't think there are many cases of guys who were great setup men that just couldn't close.
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