67s BB

[bennyhana]

dump it. you will be paying waaay too much for your weak draw. donks are easier to play when you are HU with the donker. when you have a multiway spot and horrible relative position, you have to look left before you make your decisions. IMO you should be looking left before you make most of your poker decisions.

i think preflop is fine, if you play well post.

[Smurph64]

Yeah and we get a pair here and we fold it because of a donk.Hrmm what do I need to hit to make this playable?

[bennyhana]

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah and we get a pair here and we fold it because of a donk.Hrmm what do I need to hit to make this playable?

[/ QUOTE ]

I play suited connectors against a raise as major drawing hands. If I'm playing this hand in the bb and see the limp, raise, cold call, call I'm telling myself I want a rainbow str8 draw or a flush draw or 2 pair or better. Flopping second pair (or top pair for that matter)and being stuck between a donk and a preflop raiser doesn't make me too thrilled about my hand.

[Point Blank]

SB ... 51.5/3/0.83 - 33 hands ... you have any info on what he donks (or bets and raises with)

if this guy is a tard then I'm liking a raise (so long as these other guys aren't overly aggro post flop ... or themselves cold calling morons) ...

in general - fold

or perhaps call and see (which I'm not too too hot about) if MP2 is passive and crap post flop ... MP3 doesn't look to aggro so he really should be raising only a solid hand in this spot) ... folding if it's raises and re-raised obv

the min you'll be getting is like 12:2 (but if MP2 is garbage, it should really be closer to 14:2) ... which really isn't too bad

[Bulletproof Monk]

this is a really tough spot but i usually call here

note: call = fold > raise imo

[Reaction]

[ QUOTE ]

If you don't feel like gambling any more then toss it. A raise is the cheapest chance you have of seeing two more. Two backdoor draws gives you 2 outs, pair gives you 5 more for maybe 2nd best hand. 6 outs I would guess. 6 outs for 2 needs 3.2:1 to play. You are putting a 1 in to gamble for the free card so you have the odds for the free card play.


[/ QUOTE ]

This would be a very poor application of the free card play. Biggest reason, you don’t get a free card anywhere near 100%. MP3’s range is close to 50/50 OC/OP and SB has already shown his ability to donk which increases the chance of getting donked on the turn. Also, 95% of the time the equity you paid for on the flop and granted on the turn is less then what you get to realize on the river.

[Smurph64]

totally agree but its the only hope of playing for one bet. This hand isn't worth playing for more than that, hence the reason that I don't play it with one raiser and one caller and one maybe caller. 22% preflop equity with 3 others isn't enough to warrant a call

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

1,644,682 games 10.812 secs 152,116 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 36.059% 35.67% 00.88% 586729 14506.25 { 88+, ATs+, KTs+, QJs, AQo+ }
Hand 1: 19.393% 18.72% 00.94% 307849 15500.08 { 33+, A2s+, K2s+, Q2s+, J4s+, T6s+, 96s+, 86s+, 76s, 65s, A2o+, K4o+, Q7o+, J7o+, T7o+, 98o }
Hand 2: 22.622% 21.95% 00.99% 360934 16253.58 { 55+, A2s+, K4s+, Q7s+, J8s+, T8s+, 98s, A5o+, K9o+, Q9o+, J9o+, T9o }
Hand 3: 21.927% 21.89% 00.34% 360079 5522.08 { 7s6s }

Its a fold preflop. I need 4 more in the pot for me to play 67s especially when I have to act early after the flop.

But I made the loose call anyways. So is a call any good sandwiched between PFR and donker? Both can have better hands than me. I am pretty sure one does.

I need to draw. I have about 6 outs. I have a play for free card which has to work 1 in 5 for it to pan out. If it fails I lose .5 bb on the flop more than a call.

My personal choice remains:

First: Fold preflop

failing that:

call preflop and raise donk on flop.

[Sushiglutton]

I fold with these reads. SB is LP board is dry and another problem is that MP3 seems to have tight raising standard so the risk of running into a real hand is too big. With other reads I raise this.

[JJack]

thx all for reply

I was raised it to hope I will kick out tight PFR with his overards and I will get free card on turn (SSHE says if u can call flop for one bet u can also often see also river if it will cost another one SB) cus donker looks shy and he can often check at turn.

But PFR can also have big hand or donker wont let me get free card.

So after thinking fold is rather better option then raise and call.
BTW: Stox's book says u can call with all suited cards when PF is raised and 5 villains are in cus u have very good impied odds. Here we have also good str8 potential with 3 other villains so I think its quite good call at BB.

[Oink]

LOL @ folding preflop.

Seriously.. L O L !!


You get 6:1 immediate and 7:1 with 99% probability. You are like 8 or 9 to one on flopping 2 pair or better OR a good draw like a fd and OESD.

Add in all the times you flop 1 pair or a gut with a bdfd and get to peel the flop for 1 bet.

Even tho you fold a pair in this hand on the flop it never ever becomes -EV to call preflop.

Calling preflop is a huge +EV play. Folding is ridiculous. I'd call 76o and 72s.