|
|
#12
10-17-2006, 04:05 PM
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A Big Draw OOP
[ QUOTE ]
Put me in the 'I h8 the flop c/r' club. [/ QUOTE ] I'd like to see a little more discussion of this hand. Is a flop c/r so bad here? We obviously gain some fold equity against a certain portion of villain's range. Perhaps this range is to narrow to give the flop c/r any value. Or perhaps the little fold equity we do gain doesn't justify destroying our implied odds. 
|
|
#13
10-17-2006, 04:13 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: A Big Draw OOP
I think the part of his range that we are gaining FE against isn't showing his hand down regardless. I don't think we get AQ to fold, AJ will, 88, TT, JJ as well. Pretty much the only thing that might fold for the c/r is 88.
Thing is we have a big hand so I don't think it's THAT bad.
|
|
#14
10-17-2006, 04:27 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: A Big Draw OOP
I don't think A C/R is "bad" at all. I don't think it's worthy of any hate. I just think it's better to call, primarily for these reasons:
[ QUOTE ] Perhaps this range is to narrow to give the flop c/r any value. Or perhaps the little fold equity we do gain doesn't justify destroying our implied odds. [/ QUOTE ]
|
|
#15
10-17-2006, 06:35 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: A Big Draw OOP
[ QUOTE ]
I don't think A C/R is "bad" at all. I don't think it's worthy of any hate. I just think it's better to call, primarily for these reasons: [ QUOTE ] Perhaps this range is to narrow to give the flop c/r any value. Or perhaps the little fold equity we do gain doesn't justify destroying our implied odds. [/ QUOTE ] [/ QUOTE ] Yes, calling is better. But I also think c/r'ing the flop is bad for these reasons: 1)We almost never get a better hand to fold to the a turn c-bet. 2)The turn is almost always called by a better hand 3)the turn is always raised by a better hand 4)we must always call a turn raise because of our draws 5)when our draws come in, we are not likely to make up for extra bets we incur on the turn (and flop) those times we are raised and miss our draws.
|
|
#16
10-17-2006, 06:36 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: A Big Draw OOP
Nice check-raise. When you hit your ten on the turn, I'm still assuming you're behind and drawing. I don't like the turn lead: what hands that 3b pre-flop, then call a flop c/r are you ahead of? I check/call the turn.
If I check/call this turn, I think I check/fold a blank river. What can we beat? AJs.
|
|
#18
10-17-2006, 07:21 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: A Big Draw OOP
"And we haven't talked about the turnbet yet. Does it make any sense? "
none whatsoever.
|
|
#19
10-17-2006, 07:32 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: A Big Draw OOP
[ QUOTE ]
"And we haven't talked about the turnbet yet. Does it make any sense? " none whatsoever. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, the T was the worst possible card to continue our semibluff with. We're only getting called or raised by a better hand on the turn. Check calling the turn is now the correct play. If a blank had fallen on the turn, a turn bet is a must if we raised the flop IMO. I'm starting to see the error in a flop c/r though.
|
|
#20
10-17-2006, 09:07 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: A Big Draw OOP
[ QUOTE ]
I'd like to see a little more discussion of this hand. [/ QUOTE ] Big ups to those that have responded. It's working. [ QUOTE ] I'm starting to see the error in a flop c/r though. [/ QUOTE ]
|
 |
|
|
Linear Mode
