"I have a big hand and pot odds. I fold"

[Rocco]

Hmmm, interesting... Blinds level on hand #2 would be nice to know. Anyway, I guess it's a good fold... Hand #1 I'd shove because I simply can't put him on quads or Q's over J's.

If OP was some random 'enthusiast' or something, he'd be flamed for folding #1, but since it's adanthar, people are paying more attention to the hand. And, strangely enough, the more I look at it, the more I'm convinced adanthar is behind here. I'm confused...

[gobboboy]

I talked to you about hand #1 before, I still think you have to call here. If I get AA with this short a stack I'm not going to fold it.

Bet/folding the turn in hand #2 is terrible in my opinion, at least in this tournament. I'm full potting the turn because I expect him to either be drawing to a flush, 5 outs or 2 outs. The stuper is ALL about doubling up early.

[pokerraja]

I know you won't like this response, but you cant be serious about hand 1? Do you realize you will be left with T1600 and blinds of 100-200? While we all realize as poker players you should never give up in a tourney, this is just ridiculous. Without even going into pot odds, this is one of them situations where I believe you do or die with them aces.

[mlagoo]

adanthar,

Hand 1 looks bad. Just don't fold [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

Hand 2 looks meh. 3/5 pot would be about my normal bet on this turn anyway, so i dunno why that's an issue. I think this river is one those situations where folding wouldn't be a big mistake, and calling wouldn't be a big mistake. It's pretty marginal. So I'd probably call, because I read some Matt Matros article where he said when you're in marginal situations like that, you should take the action that gains you the most information for the future.


ps -- that property exam was a goddamn trainwreck. i'm gonna cry myself to sleep.

[sledghammer]

I can't imagine being behind more than 30% of the time in hand one. I play the dise rebuy 3 or 4 times a week. If I had to put people on hands, I'd say SB has a pp, 22-TT, and BB has KQ. Since, in the eyes of those great dise donks, you can't have an overpair, you have to call here. However, knowing the stack sizes and the final bet size is important, since BB may make a large overbet with a J. Even then I don't think you can fold. They put you on AK.

[Melchiades]

I don't get the fold in hand 1 at all.

[Exitonly]

the arguement "we have a short stack, so i'm not folding with aces" is stupid, but i do think we're ahead here more than 30% so i dont fold hand 1 either

hand 2, why not just check behind on the turn?

edit: 2nd thought, eh [censored] a check, and bleh probably pay him off on the end. but i'll think about that more.

[registrar]

I mean I call hand #1 because I'm steaming that I've only got 2600 after the break, 1600 after this hand. I'd probably also try and persuade myself that the two aces in my hand make it less likley that he's calling with a J etc. etc.

However assuming you are BB and have J10. How do you play this? Check, call, push?

I like the message in the post. Some of my most vehement poker arguments have dealt with the same issue. "Look man, I don't care how bad he is, what pot odds I'm being laid, how much I've invested in the pot, what dire straits folding leaves me in. I am sure I'm behind and I'm folding like a little girl."

There are times like Scotty Nguyen had it: you call here and it's all over baby.

I don't actually think hand one is one of those times, most of the time. Hand two I can't fold because of pot odds, because he's so bad, because folding leaves me in such duire straits etc. etc.

[BPA234]

Hand 1:

I know you prefer to not talk about the flop. But, I thnk the flop action is a mistake. Both blinds calling preflop means that they either have something or they are donks. Either way I think you are giving up value by not making a bet on the flop. Preferably a weakish bet that looks like you missed the flop. Obv, you are hoping for a reraise so you can jam or you are building the pot to give odds to call when you jam the turn.

On the turn, with your stack and the action so far, you either fold or raise. If you call the turn knowing you are beat, then you obv have to fold the river.

Hand2:

I think perfect action preflop and flop. The 2 on the turn is not likely to have helped the villain. I think you are most often way ahead here, so I would make a pot-committing bet or just shove the turn.

I think you almost always have to pay off the river, unless you are confident that the vill was on the draw.

Wow. If anyone but andathar posts Hand 1, then get ripped apart. I, for one, think this a very bad fold.

Edit: And why is checking the flop so "standard?" I think betting this flop is perfectly fine, if not preferrable. But then again, this assumes I will be going broke anyway if one of the Villains has a J. Clearly this does not apply to you.