ZeeJustin the next to get caught multi accounting Party MTTs

[perrier]

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After his weak, lame, sad attempt at a rebuttal in here I'm eagerly awaiting a new blog or article on his website. I'm certain he'll attempt to indulge us in more lame self pitty. With that, why would a kid with so much potential, talent, and resort to using such methods to get ahead of the game? This is an obvious answer, but I still want to know why, why Justin, why? Will something like this put into question whether he really is a talented player? Does he lose all of his credibility? How will this affect him in the real world on and off the felt?

I wonder if his humongous ego will get in the way of him handling this in a professional matter.

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I think he is reacting like this (stolen from the OOT forum)

ZJ founds out he's been caught cheating.

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OMFGLOLOCOPTER2XTREMEROFLBBQNESS!

Edit: Watch to the end.

[astarck]

I think the real losers here are the moderators of this fine forum. Keeping a near record thread in check is quite a task. Excellent job.

Edited to add for clarity - Losers as in not winners.

Edited to add again for additional clarity - As CSC put it, HEROES.

[microbet]

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lol yeah who is this ackbleh guy anyway. Way to take one sentence out of his post and ignore all the rest. Most serious poker players know who ackbleh is.

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My point had nothing to do with how talented a poker player he might be.

My point was he has 9 posts and makes a blanket statement about the "hundreds" coming out of the woodwork due to jealousy.

I didn't realize only high stakes players had a voice that mattered here. I guess it's similar to the high stakes players being privy to who's cheating while us "less serious" players are left in the dark.

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Yea I actually have a list of cheaters, I'll sell it for $100.

Anyway people's post count isn't really relevant in this discussion. Ackbleh makes an attempt at a well thought out post looking at everything from an almost completely objective standpoint, I find it petty that you would pinpoint that one sentence.

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You're right, ack was trying to make a fair post and maybe he's upset because ZJ is a friend or acquaintance, but a successful player referring to a bunch of players he doesn't know as never-will-bes is being a bit of an ackhole.

[CardSharpCook]

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I think the real heroes here are the moderators of this fine forum. Keeping a near record thread in check is quite a task. Excellent job.

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I know what you meant, so this FYP is meant to make that a little clearer.

[astarck]

Yeah, I reread it and I realized my post could be taken in many different ways. Here's to a very hungover Saturday morning.

[sirio11]

I just found Lee Jones comments regarding Noah Beken multiaccounting.

I find them pretty interesting

Lee Jones and PS position regarding Noah multiaccounting

[BassMasterK]

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Let's keep this in proportion.

I've read ZJ's and I can easily believe that the reason he used 6 accounts was because only playing 1 account in an MTT is kind of dull when you are used to multi-tabling. Yes it would give him an unfair advantage if two of his accounts ended up at the same table, but I don't believe this was his main purpose in using multiple accounts. I don't believe that it happens very frequently in a tournament and I don't believe when it does happen that the advantage is huge.

To me, this makes it a 2nd degree offense. It is not acceptable and he deserves to have any money he won in MTTs where he did this and redistributed amongst the other players.

However, if I had been dumb enough to do and get caught pulling something like this when I was 19 (I prolly was), what would hurt me most would be the reaction of almost everybody here. Again I don't believe his primary intention was to gain an small advantage. I don't know the kid, but I think it is sad how a lot of haters are jumping on this as if he had dealt from the bottom of the deck.

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This is a weak ass excuse.

If someone is bored playing one table at a time, then they can enter multiple SEPERATE tourneys on one site, or spread them among tourneys on several sites. It's that simple. The only reason to enter the same tourney more than once is to cheat. It's that simple.

To all who say it isn't that big of a deal think about this.

In a big tourney if you finished one spot behind one of these cheaters who are playing 2 to 10 seats...they could effectively be taking TENS OF THOUSANDS of dollars from you that should have been yours if they hadn't been able to multi-seat the tourney.

Still no big deal?

[sirio11]

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Ok guys, time to place your bets.

Since the mods don't allow new threads here, I posted in NVG.

Here

Please post your favorites to get caught in that thread.

Thanks in advance.

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Well, looks like that post was deleted. Nobody has sent me any notification at all (not that they need to)

I agree that a witch hunt is not a good thing. But definetely whistleblowers are needed to help stop the cheating.

[curtains]

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shaniac,

"It's probable that he didn't set out to do any kind of obvious chip-dumping in the MTTs or colluding in cash games."

I too believe that is most likely true. For the person who asked why, it is because from chatting/posting w/ ZJ, it seemed like he was not inherently bad in terms of being a cheater in his core out to screw anyone at any cost, but moreso just someone with a somewhat hazy moral compass and a much stronger pull from the greed of making the $$$$ and fame of winning. The problem is, when someone has a policy of creating their ethics based on what they and their friends decide can by some rationalization by deemed "within the rules" then it's not too far-fetched to see good intentions veer just slightly away from original intent, then a little more, then.....

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If I didn't know ZJ at all other than from reading a few of his posts, which is probably the case of a decent number of contributers to this thread, I would assume that he cheated in many other ways than those he is being punished for.

I personally don't believe that in this specific case, but if I just found out some random person that I didn't know at all did something very unethical, I would assume the were doing more unethical things.

[BassMasterK]

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shaniac,

I only play a couple tourneys a year so it really doesn't affect me. But your refusal to out known cheaters is somewhat of a cheat by you since you know when to be leary of such a multiple presence on a table but other 2+2'ers here don't. So you benefit by that knowlege and refuse the benefit of it to them, as well as the benefit of stopping it.

Plus most importantly, your inaction is what enables those cheaters to continue cheating and damage the reputation of online poker for integrity that we all depend upon to garner a stream of newer players.

Shame on you for your cowardice.

And note that I am not condemning the practice of multiple accounts for the purpose of masking one's play from dataminers when such a person with same never attempts to login on more than one account at a time and play.

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Call it cowardice if you like, but I never have and never will go out of my way to burn someone. In case I didn't make it clear (and maybe this is cowardice, or spinelessness), I let people convince me that the practice of multiplayering was actually okay. It was so widespread, I assumed everyone was on the inside, and by virtue of my non-participation I was on the outside and would one day need to catch up. As I said like 12 pages ago in this thread, I am happy that multi-accounting has been established as a clear wrong ("cheating") and that my ethical gut-reaction to it has been justified. I'm sorry if you think I'm a coward or a lowlife, but I don't answer to you or your moral authority.

All I can do is what I believe what curtains was trying to do--convince people that it was clearly wrong and let them argue otherwise. But I'm not sure what world you live in where someone reveals a secret to you in confidence, you tell them you disagree with it, then turn around and drop a dime.

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Funny shaniac because you are burning someone. A bunch of someones. They are called 'honest people'. They outnumber the one(s) you are protecting.

So if my buddy scams you out of a bunch of $$ I assume you wouldn't want me to turn him in and get your money back to you right?

Thought so.