Official Blather about ZeeJustin Till The End of Time Thread

[Paluka]

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The kid didn't have $100,000 to his name a year ago. There is no way that taking it from him now will "ruin him" in any way.


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With all due respect, it doesn't matter. These arguments are worthless. 100K is 100K and its a lot of $$ no matter who you are. You cannot base punishments on how badly someone will be hurt finacially. Let's do what's right and come up with a good proposal to send to the sites. We must do what's right here.

Indy

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He won like $137,000 in a single tourney that he is known to have cheated in. I don't understand how taking LESS than that much from him can be wrong. If party had taken away his entire winnings from that tourney 10 minutes after the tourney had ended because he cheated, you would probably be saying that they did the right thing.

[gergery]

You appear unfamiliar with the concept of punitive damages or the deterrent effect, which are central principles in our criminal justice system.

You also miss the main transgression resulting from ZJ’s actions --- it was NOT the injury to other players whose equity was hurt in those tournaments -- rather it was the damage to the perceived integrity of both PartyPoker and online poker in general.

You think ZJ ACTION’s were just bad and not extremely bad. I disagree. But the more important point is that the resulting IMPACT from his behavior is far greater than the magnitude of his actions alone. And that is the point you seem to be missing.

-g

[jmillerdls]

Wow, you are delusional.
I always thought you were fairly level-headed in the SNG forum, but after reading through all your posts in this thread...well, I'll be avoiding any advice you give in the future.

Unless this is your little sister playing a prank on your 2+2 name, which would make a lot of sense. I can't see someone going on and on like this that actually plays poker for a living (unless they have been caught, or anticipate being caught for doing the same thing).

[DMBFan23]

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Indy, curious as to what you do that would be considered unethical.


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I don't like to judge people or anything but what Zee did was unethical for sure. He phucked it up and should be punished, I'm not arguing that. As for unethical behaviors, how fast did you drive in that 55mph zone this morning on the way to work. Have you ever gone 65, knowing that you were breaking the law?

Indy

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ethics and laws are not the same thing, you do realize this right?

[Indiana]

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ethics and laws are not the same thing, you do realize this right?

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Yes I realize this and that I made a bad example. Sorry, do I need to go join Zee at the stoning post for making this mistake in life?

Indy

[kevbo]

So basically Party should ban him and not take his money? He knew the consequences of his actions. He cheated Party and it's customers and deserves what he got.

So if a guy robs a bank and gets caught, then he should give back the money he stole and offer an apology and everything will be forgiven?? Of course not - THERE ARE ADDITIONAL CONSEQUENCES!! This is why I have no problem with Party confiscating all of his funds.

Forgive him - sure, he's a kid making a dumb mistake, but still punish him for what he's done. It is the only way to learn for some folks. Plus, Party's actions will likely deter others from doing the same. It won't completely eliminate cheaters, but it will reduce them.

[DMBFan23]

ok, use this example. some people were robbed of hundreds, possibly thousands, of dollars by this kid. you don't think they should get their money back?

[Indiana]

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I always thought you were fairly level-headed in the SNG forum,

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I'm not a "level-headed" person all the time. I do phuck up and make mistakes. That does not make me wrong in all my poker arguments, it doesn't make me a criminal, and it doesn't define me. I phuck up all the time and I make mistakes. So do you guys, obviously. Zee screwed up and deserves to be punished. I'm just concerned that we are ruining the guys dreams and aspirations and frankly I'd like to play against him to better my game. I think that he could end up being really really good at poker, but not if we ban him from all internet sites and public cardrooms like many are suggesting.

Indy

[Ansky]

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You appear unfamiliar with the concept of punitive damages or the deterrent effect, which are central principles in our criminal justice system.

You also miss the main transgression resulting from ZJ’s actions --- it was NOT the injury to other players whose equity was hurt in those tournaments -- rather it was the damage to the perceived integrity of both PartyPoker and online poker in general.

You think ZJ ACTION’s were just bad and not extremely bad. I disagree. But the more important point is that the resulting IMPACT from his behavior is far greater than the magnitude of his actions alone. And that is the point you seem to be missing.

-g

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And that sums it up. Nice post.

[jcm4ccc]

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Sorry, do I need to go join Zee at the stoning post for making this mistake in life?

Indy

[/ QUOTE ] No, but you can join Zee at the stoning post for skirting the rules of this forum by mispelling banned words ("chXX" "phXXXXXX").