Monumental mistake by Wasicka in the ME?

[curtains]

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I'm not sure what is meant by the question.
Captain Obvious says shortest stack gets 3rd, bigger stack gets 2nd, Gold is happy as hell that he didn't have to deal with HU, and ESPN wishes there was more of a pressure cooking finale.

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Well captain obvious didnt use this rule in the WPT Main event like 3 years ago, in which players who were eliminated at the same hand split 18th place if I recall.

[curtains]

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This hand has been posted all over 2+2, at first I was very critical of Wasicka, but now I think it comes down to one thing.

If you call Gold's all in you have to expect Binger to fold, in fact for Binger to do anything else is improper. So why go heads up and risk elimination plus dropping in the money on a coin flip at best because Gold could have a higher flush draw or a set and you are not leading in either case. When you look at it in those terms it is incorrect to call.

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Dude cmon you dont even know what Binger has and he has almost half his stack in the pot, you shouldnt EXPECT him to fold there.

[Thundercat32]

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This hand has been posted all over 2+2, at first I was very critical of Wasicka, but now I think it comes down to one thing.

If you call Gold's all in you have to expect Binger to fold, in fact for Binger to do anything else is improper. So why go heads up and risk elimination plus dropping in the money on a coin flip at best because Gold could have a higher flush draw or a set and you are not leading in either case. When you look at it in those terms it is incorrect to call.

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Dude cmon you dont even know what Binger has and he has almost half his stack in the pot, you shouldnt EXPECT him to fold there.

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To be honest when I first saw a thread about this hand in televised poker, I thought Binger was already all in on the flop, the fact that he is not, and the fact he has nearly 14 BB left makes it a substantial risk that calling will get you heads up not in a coin flip (at best) for 1st, but a coin flip to stave off busting out in 3rd.

When Wasicka decides whether or not to call the risk of Binger folding behind is very real, it's a fact I overlooked initially and I believe many posters are overlooking now.

In fact if Wasicka had called knowing Binger's meager TPTK he would of folded for certain not only for the increase in payout but for fearing his was not the best hand. Than everyone watching that PPV would of gotten sick to their stomach seeing Gold hit his 7 on the turn and for that brief moment or two before the river card is dealt everyone would be understanding why this is a highly dangerous call much more clearly

[curtains]

Yes its definitely possible he will fold, but not something we should expect once he has put half his stack in the pot.

[SuperUberBob]

There's no doubt I'm calling this.

Let's see how this goes down if I'm Wasicka:

1) I fold, Binger calls. If Gold wins, I'm guaranteed second place but have a very slim chance of winning heads up.

2) I fold, Binger calls. Binger wins the pot. Now I'm the short stack and pretty darn screwed.

3) I fold, Binger folds. We both get pussy whipped by Gold as he takes in another big pot. My chances for first decrease even further and I'm not quite guaranteed second either.

4) I call, Binger calls. Gold wins the main and side pot. I am guaranteed second place since I had the bigger stack.

5) I call, Binger calls. I win the main and side pot, bust Binger and I once again am guaranteed second place. Plus I have a better chance at busting Gold heads up.

6) I call, Binger calls. Binger wins main pot but I win the side pot. The sidepot is large enough where I still increase my chip stack. The stacks between myself and Binger around probably even now. I believe I can outplay Binger and thus I have an edge for second place against him. Gold is weakened, but not that much.

7) I call, Binger calls. Binger wins main pot. Gold takes side pot and I bust out in third.

8) I call, Binger folds. I bust.

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There are only two scenarios that will bust me here. Out of eight. There's clearly more to gain by calling. Two out of five of the calling scenarios guarantee me second place. One has me about even in chips with Binger and my capability to outplay him give me an edge for second. Only two ways I bust here.

If I fold, I'm only guaranteed second if Binger calls and busts on the hand. Otherwise, either Gold takes a chunk out of both of us if we fold and if Binger calls and wins, I'm destined for third place.

From there, you have to use your judgment on what's what. Binger's will probably call if I call since the pot is so large and Binger has so little left. If I fold, Binger would probably feel more certain that he has Jamie beat along with having half his stack already in the pot and will call then as well. So either way, Binger's probably calling.

If I fold, I risk allowing Binger to get more chips and have a strong grasp on second place since I would be inclined to believe that Binger has Gold beat.

Again, I call. In this circumstance, the odds of my hand being the worst out of the three isn't strong enough to get me to fold.

[LearnedfromTV]

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[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure what is meant by the question.
Captain Obvious says shortest stack gets 3rd, bigger stack gets 2nd, Gold is happy as hell that he didn't have to deal with HU, and ESPN wishes there was more of a pressure cooking finale.

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Well captain obvious didnt use this rule in the WPT Main event like 3 years ago, in which players who were eliminated at the same hand split 18th place if I recall.

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At the world series, I believe placings for multiple elimination situations are in fact determined by pre-hand chip count. It happened to me in a Second Chance.

[curtains]

Ok, I just wasn't sure, thanks

[IcyHotMonkey]

It's ok. Sometimes Captain Obvious can be wrong. If he wasn't, then he'd be promoted to Major Obvious or Lt. Colonel Obvious.

[IcyHotMonkey]

So I'm top3 in a second chance event. Long long night, so we want to chop. They won't let us chop or give us time out to discuss. So we all incur a fake penalty and discuss off table. Turns out a couple days before they agreed to let some guys chop, but according to rules and regulations someone had to end up with all the chips. So the guy got 1st and refused to split the money once 1st prize was distributed to him by the cashier. So we promised to beat each other up if one of us tried and chopped anyway. Who thought players would be that evil at the WSOP? Which reminds me of a situation in which I'll post tomorrow that happened at that FT.