Phil Ivey Gossip

[ESKiMO-SiCKNE5S]

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Clearly a switch-a-roo





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so so so awesome lol

[samsdmf]

Ehat I think is Tiger Woods was playing on HIVS account

[grdred944]

Great thread. I'm glad we got info from Marc.

From everything posted it appears as if Phil knowlingly lied. Nothing could be misconstrued from what he said. Again, if all of this is true, he is a liar, a cheat and a hustler. Which makes him like 80% of the degenerates out there.

[TripleH68]

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if ivey knowingly lied about his handicap, its cheating, not hustling. plain and simple.

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for official purposes anyway...

-1/1. Procedure for Player who Discontinues Play for Lengthy Period and Then Resumes Play

Q: A player with an established Handicap Index discontinues play for a lengthy period, and then resumes play. Should the player use the last Handicap Index on resumption of play or establish a new Handicap Index?

A: The player does not have a Handicap Index until the next scheduled handicap revision. The player's club handicap committee may issue a Handicap Index (M) sooner if at least five scores exist in the scoring record.

If the scoring record of the player is unavailable when resuming play, the player has no Handicap Index until five scores have been posted and a handicap revision passes. (revised)

[Devil Duq]

I for one am willing to accept Mr. Goodwin's post at face value, but it hardly holds him blameless in this affair. It does however raise some interesting points. Let's review:

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Reply from Marc Goodwin over on Blondepoker...
At the start of the game we said to Phil that as we haven't played for 3 months and he must have improved we need to adjust the handicaps. We could not agree and we were doomed to no game until Ram said "does Eric Lingdren still give you 10 shots" to which Phil replied yes!!On that piece of information we had a game. As we always bitch about handicaps throughout the match Phil suggested that we agree to play 18 holes with no adjustment and then adjust for the next series of games. We agreed.

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This scenario is laughably typical of gambling degeneracy. How does one agree to a golf match at these stakes based upon someone's unverified handicap claim? Moreover, how does one agree to do this with no provision for mid-round adjustment? Is Goodwin at least willing to admit that he made an appallingly stupid bet, and if so, what responsibility does he bear when he loses that bet?

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..as anyone who plays golf would know when playing better ball doubles it is very hard to win by 3 or more holes, they finished 14 up lol.

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For those not in the know regarding golf match terms, better ball doubles is a team competition, in which the two players on the team each play their own ball throughout the round. The low score, or "better ball", among the two on each hole is the team's score for that hole.

Therefore, this match was in fact a four person match, one assumes between Goodwin/Vaswani and Ivey/?. Who was that other person? Was this mystery player in on the alleged cheat? What is their view on this whole affair?

The hard truth is that giving 10 shots in a better ball match is insane, unless you're matched up against a blind man and a quadruple amputee. I assert that Goodwin and Vaswani were so desperate to make a match that they were willing to agree to vastly unfavorable terms. There's no more fertile field for a hustle than this.

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We had been spanked but arranged a new revised game later that week. We went out together that night (even though we have severed ties and have all this supposed ill feeling). Later on we met Eric who informed us that he gives Phil NO SHOTS. We therefore felt aggrieved and Ram asked Phil for an apology. As to wether we pay or not will be discussed in Vegas in April when we next meet.

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It sounds as though the best resolution to this affair would be an April rematch in Vegas with Phil (and teammate?) getting zero stroke advantage, for double the disputed amount. Might I suggest giving ESPN a call; perhaps they can help sweeten the pot a bit by recording this grudge match for posterity.

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Let me put this question to you all. If i had turned up with a pro golfer and Phil said do you get shots off Eric, we said yes 10. We played and won then he found out should he pay even a penny? If you think that he has been hustled not cheated and its just unlucky then you must be of the opinion that we should pay....To gain an edge yes to win at all costs no thankyou.

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Again, I offer a reminder that YOU agreed to the terms and YOU chose to accept Ivey's claim with no verification, despite the fact that a simple phone call to Eric Lindgren would have exposed the hustle/lie/cheat and avoided all this ill will.

I happen to be of the opinion that one should take responsibility for making bad bets. The bottom line is that there is no lesson better learned than the one that costs you money.

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If when we meet and we cant agree we will probably pay and sever ties. I will let you all know the outcome this April.

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Please do.

[jah7_fsu1]

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Marc Goodwin, a very self-regarding semi-successful tournament player (and ex double-glazing salesman) plays off scratch (zero handicap) and has been very boastful of his friendship with Ivey and how he has made lumps of money playing golf with him over the last year or so.

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If this is true I don't see what the big deal is. Marc has made lots off Ivey in the past, and is pretty sure he is +EV against Ivey again. Ivey sets up a scenario where he is +EV against a guy who routinely takes him for big dollars. Ivey takes Marc for big dollars and now everyone is pissed. Ivey goes from the easy donator to the easy taker. This seems like a flat out hustle to me, and people acting like Ivey is the Pope is what is surprising. He is a gambler, all these guys are gamblers and they are going to do what it takes to get their money in with the best chance to make more. Marc had been doing it, Ivey did it here. All the same thing right? Yes, I know Ivey hustled, cheated, whatever you want to call it, but isn't it sort of all the same? Isn't Marc playing Ivey at + 10 shots back when Marc could give him 15 shots and still win easy pretty much the same thing when you get down to it?

Maybe I'm missing something...I'm not trying to defend Ivey really, that is just the way I'm reading into this thread so far.

[Flacks]

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I for one am willing to accept Mr. Goodwin's post at face value, but it hardly holds him blameless in this affair. It does however raise some interesting points. Let's review:

[ QUOTE ]
Reply from Marc Goodwin over on Blondepoker...
At the start of the game we said to Phil that as we haven't played for 3 months and he must have improved we need to adjust the handicaps. We could not agree and we were doomed to no game until Ram said "does Eric Lingdren still give you 10 shots" to which Phil replied yes!!On that piece of information we had a game. As we always bitch about handicaps throughout the match Phil suggested that we agree to play 18 holes with no adjustment and then adjust for the next series of games. We agreed.

[/ QUOTE ]
This scenario is laughably typical of gambling degeneracy. How does one agree to a golf match at these stakes based upon someone's unverified handicap claim? Moreover, how does one agree to do this with no provision for mid-round adjustment? Is Goodwin at least willing to admit that he made an appallingly stupid bet, and if so, what responsibility does he bear when he loses that bet?
[ QUOTE ]
..as anyone who plays golf would know when playing better ball doubles it is very hard to win by 3 or more holes, they finished 14 up lol.

[/ QUOTE ]

For those not in the know regarding golf match terms, better ball doubles is a team competition, in which the two players on the team each play their own ball throughout the round. The low score, or "better ball", among the two on each hole is the team's score for that hole.

Therefore, this match was in fact a four person match, one assumes between Goodwin/Vaswani and Ivey/?. Who was that other person? Was this mystery player in on the alleged cheat? What is their view on this whole affair?

The hard truth is that giving 10 shots in a better ball match is insane, unless you're matched up against a blind man and a quadruple amputee. I assert that Goodwin and Vaswani were so desperate to make a match that they were willing to agree to vastly unfavorable terms. There's no more fertile field for a hustle than this.

[ QUOTE ]
We had been spanked but arranged a new revised game later that week. We went out together that night (even though we have severed ties and have all this supposed ill feeling). Later on we met Eric who informed us that he gives Phil NO SHOTS. We therefore felt aggrieved and Ram asked Phil for an apology. As to wether we pay or not will be discussed in Vegas in April when we next meet.

[/ QUOTE ]

It sounds as though the best resolution to this affair would be an April rematch in Vegas with Phil (and teammate?) getting zero stroke advantage, for double the disputed amount. Might I suggest giving ESPN a call; perhaps they can help sweeten the pot a bit by recording this grudge match for posterity.

[ QUOTE ]
Let me put this question to you all. If i had turned up with a pro golfer and Phil said do you get shots off Eric, we said yes 10. We played and won then he found out should he pay even a penny? If you think that he has been hustled not cheated and its just unlucky then you must be of the opinion that we should pay....To gain an edge yes to win at all costs no thankyou.

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, I offer a reminder that YOU agreed to the terms and YOU chose to accept Ivey's claim with no verification, despite the fact that a simple phone call to Eric Lindgren would have exposed the hustle/lie/cheat and avoided all this ill will.
I happen to be of the opinion that one should take responsibility for making bad bets. The bottom line is that there is no lesson better learned than the one that costs you money.

[ QUOTE ]
If when we meet and we cant agree we will probably pay and sever ties. I will let you all know the outcome this April.

[/ QUOTE ]

Please do.

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Just sounds like one hustler getting hustled because he wanted action so bad that his brain wouldn't override his desire to play.

As a side note..I wouldn't trust my mother to give me an honest handicap let alone a gambler.

[RiverFenix]

I cant believe people dont get the Happy Gilmore reference.

[Vince.]

[ QUOTE ]
Clearly a switch-a-roo





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POTY

[wtfsvi]

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Maybe I'm missing something...I'm not trying to defend Ivey really, that is just the way I'm reading into this thread so far.

[/ QUOTE ] What you are missing is this:

Goodwin: Does Eric still give you 10 shots?
Ivey: yes