Staking/Make-up question: What to do with lower prize-pools? - Page 3

WarDekar · #1 10-20-2007, 12:21 AM

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it seems to me, you entered into an agreement with someone who is putting up money you cannot afford to play for and is giving you a very big shot compared to what your roi on stars would dictate.

when things get a little rough, you really have no moral right to whine that you are obligated to make up the money you lost before you see cash.

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Huh? For the record just so you know we have never had any written or official agreement. He's a friend of mine and offered to stake me over the summer in bigger buy-ins live, and now that has continued after the summer. This is also a reason why this is a situation because there is no set deal like "I'm going to play $X in buy-ins" or "I'm going to play Y amount of tournaments." I accepted this offer obviously but we never had anything set as to what I was playing under him. At the time I played whatever I wanted online, and continue to play anything I want to online under my own bankroll.

That's another reason why I'm not sure what to do because where's the cut-off? I can play the Sunday Majors under my own roll, and do sometimes. Should he be staking me in that , too, to be fair? As I said I feel comfortable bank-roll wise putting myself in these tournaments but I'm not going to do that because I don't think it's fair to my backer, is it fair if I won 100k online for instance in the Mil?

And I'm not sure why you guys are giving me a hard-time, it's not like I'm saying I'm running off or trying to erase my make-up to 0, that's not what I'm doing at all. Obviously I'm going to try to play out of make-up and I feel worse about losing someone elses' money than I do about losing my own. Quite frankly Bob, you're being a huge jerk which is completely unwarranted and from someone that I've never even seen post before.

bobneptune · #2 10-20-2007, 03:49 AM

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And I'm not sure why you guys are giving me a hard-time, it's not like I'm saying I'm running off or trying to erase my make-up to 0, that's not what I'm doing at all. Obviously I'm going to try to play out of make-up and I feel worse about losing someone elses' money than I do about losing my own. Quite frankly Bob, you're being a huge jerk which is completely unwarranted and from someone that I've never even seen post before.

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mr huge jerk here,

you ask why everyone is giving you a hard time.... well, it seems as though you want to have your cake and eat it, too.

you want your backer to stake you in big events where there is a chance to hit the ball out of the park, but you whine like a sissy-boy that playing 12 hours and getting no cash to try to get your man even makes it impossible for you to play your best. jesus, that's pretty much what most are giving you a hard time about. it seems quite infantile.

look, no one here knows what deal you have with your backer.... that's between the 2 of you. if there are some unexplored areas, by all means , square them away. that being said, it's clear what you should do. you should tell your man you intend to play events x,y and z. since you are into him for 15k, how can you not possibly give him the option of backing your under your regular deal ??? if he wants the action, you are obligated to give it to him. should he not be interested.... play for your own account.

but i'm sure you realize that would be the right thing to do. really.... i don't understand what the discussion is about.

and, for the record, i'll feel free to post my thoughts here as long as they are within the rules of this board whether you think if have the requisite standing or not.

mr huge jerk signing off........

SofaKing420 · #3 10-20-2007, 02:56 AM

you ask if there is a way to buy back part of yourself. sure their is... go out and borrow the 15 dimes and pay the man back and then start over with the original deal. either that, or work it off by playing and winning to get back to zero. this is business.... you cannot expect to buy back part of yourself with your GOOD LOOKS for collateral.

LOL @ GOOD LOOKS

Matt24 · #4 10-19-2007, 06:25 PM

The good solution is to work your makeup off, I mean if youre stuck 20k and you cash for 15k, now youre only stuck 5k, I don't see how this isn't a good thing. I had a guy stuck over 30k the day he won the $10r for 10k, it all helps even if you don't get any of it in your pocket. I would hate for any of my players to take this stance when stuck deep in makeup.

djk123 · #5 10-19-2007, 06:37 PM

it's just part of being backed. the only way to get out of makeup is to keep playing

RandALLin · #6 10-19-2007, 07:27 PM

Yeah if you have to play only to get profit out of a win you shouldn't be playing tournaments. I was in an enourmous amount of makeup, won the stuper, stil had an enormous amount of makeup. Yes, it is demoralizing, but I don't play for fun. I play for a living which constitutes me doing whatever is most profitable. Now, if you just play as a hobby, then I'd only play what you had fun playing. Me, I play for a living so I have to play whatever I'm +EV in to pay the bills. If you can't play knowing it's all going towards you eventually winning money then you shouldn't play tournaments backed.

Clayton · #7 10-19-2007, 11:37 PM

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Yeah if you have to play only to get profit out of a win you shouldn't be playing tournaments. I was in an enourmous amount of makeup, won the stuper, stil had an enormous amount of makeup. Yes, it is demoralizing, but I don't play for fun. I play for a living which constitutes me doing whatever is most profitable. Now, if you just play as a hobby, then I'd only play what you had fun playing. Me, I play for a living so I have to play whatever I'm +EV in to pay the bills. If you can't play knowing it's all going towards you eventually winning money then you shouldn't play tournaments backed.

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this did a better job explaining it than me, didnt read it first go round. listen 2 randal.

Zetack · #8 10-22-2007, 02:36 PM

In one of your posts you say that the backer is amenable to working something out, but you just can't decide what's fair.

Fine, here's your modified backing structure. (Sit down with your backer and agree on what size tourneys the modified structure applies to.) In these smaller buy in tourneys, when you cash, subtract the amount of the buy in (this goes to the backer). You keep 22.5% of the amount over the buy-in and the rest goes to make-up. If you don't cash the amount of the buy-in is added to your make-up amount.

In larger buy-in tourneys, proceed as before, all winnings go to to make up until you're in the black again.

Boom - problem solved. Move on.

--Zetack

PITTM · #9 10-22-2007, 05:08 PM

Here is what I dont get:

Obviously this guy is short on cash as he "needs" a backer.

It doesnt sound like you appreciate your "need" for cash if youre saying "nah this event is too small, not worth me winning".

Soulman · #10 10-23-2007, 02:43 AM

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Here is what I dont get:

Obviously this guy is short on cash as he "needs" a backer.

It doesnt sound like you appreciate your "need" for cash if youre saying "nah this event is too small, not worth me winning".

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He's short on money for playing big events which he's still +EV in, like 2k+ or whatever, but not smaller events. Would be the same thing for me: I'd appreciate a stake into 1k events, but I wouldn't want the staker to back me for $50s or whatever.