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#271
09-04-2007, 03:50 PM
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Re: More Bonds
[ QUOTE ]
I found it interesting that Bonds was never higher than 3rd and only cracked the top 10 twice until age 34. [/ QUOTE ] Would you also find it interesting that Aaron didn't lead the league in this category until he turned 37? And then he lead the league for 3 consecutive seasons, at age 37, 38, and 39? Or is that not interesting because it doesn't support your case? [ QUOTE ] His (Bonds) career comparable at Baseball Reference for 3 straight years up until age 32 is Duke Snider. [/ QUOTE ] Willie Mays career comparable at Baseball Reference for 4 straight years from age 28-31 was also Duke Snider. Oops! Oddly enough, the second career comparable for both Bonds and Mays at ages 28-32 are <u>each other.</u> Double Oops! And guess what....Duke Snider was a pretty darn good player until he was hobbled by injuries and moving to a cavernous pitcher-friendly ballpark at age 31. How soon we forget the three-way debates that raged between The Duke, Willie, and The Mick. [ QUOTE ] Duke was not what you would call a great HR hitter (407 lifetime). [/ QUOTE ] Um...he averaged 42HR a year during the very stretch that you identified him being comparable by age to Barry Bonds (and Willie Mays.) Granted, his career total is a "mere" 407, but that was in part because he got hurt and moved to LA around age 31, which is why you don't see him show up on any comparable lists afterwards. Remember, in the Duke's case, 316 of those 407 career HR's came by age 30, and that he tailed off due to injury and park factor is certainly not cause to say he wasn't a great HR Hitter. He was. Oh BTW, Mays had 319 at the same point in his career, only three more than Snider. 
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#274
09-04-2007, 04:44 PM
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Re: More Bonds
[ QUOTE ]
I don't know about everyone else, but I'm clearly convinced. [/ QUOTE ] Thanks, man. It means a lot. Especially considering it's coming from someone who resorted to childish personal insults earlier in this thread, in the absence of being able to address the facts. Hey look, ma! I can be sarcastic too! [ QUOTE ] I'm going to join you at Barry's altar next time you go. [/ QUOTE ] The next homestand starts Friday. I'll pick up two extra tickets so you and your strawman can come along. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]
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#276
09-04-2007, 08:36 PM
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Re: More Bonds
[ QUOTE ]
Really? I'm not. (Seriously.) [/ QUOTE ] Your thoughts on Bonds aside, I'd think you'd agree with the statement, no? : "An increase in HR rate after age 35 is not indicative of steroid use." After all, Canseco, Caminiti, and Palmeiro's HR rate decreased after age 35. Conversely- Ripken, Gwynn, Ted Williams, Griffey Jr., Bonds and Aaron's HR rate increased after age 35. And don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to "prove" Bond's innocence. I'm trying to illustrate that someone cannot assign guilt based on an increase in HR rate after age 35. It's as much a common fallacy as the folks running around screaming that Bonds wears a size 8 hat when he doesn't. [ QUOTE ] But that doesn't mean that RedBean didn't pwn your ass. [/ QUOTE ] Awww.....you're too kind. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]
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#277
09-04-2007, 08:58 PM
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Re: More Bonds
[ QUOTE ]
Your thoughts on Bonds aside, I'd think you'd agree with the statement, no? : "An increase in HR rate after age 35 is not indicative of steroid use." [/ QUOTE ] Yes.
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#279
09-06-2007, 03:38 AM
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Re: More Bonds
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Anyone who isn't suspicious of a player with a dozen years of established performance that he suddenly dwarves and puts in the greatest baseball seasons of all-time in four consecutive seasons at an age where players are not only not at their peak but usually decline (and if they don't decline they sure as hell don't shatter their previous best seasons) [/ QUOTE ] Just out of curiosity, are you also suspicious of the majority of other recent HOFers who increased their HR rate at an age when players usually decline? Or just the ones with over 760 homeruns? [/ QUOTE ] The point you're missing is that I don't care about just HR rate.
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#280
09-06-2007, 04:17 AM
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Re: More Bonds
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Anyone who isn't suspicious of a player with a dozen years of established performance that he suddenly dwarves and puts in the greatest baseball seasons of all-time in four consecutive seasons at an age where players are not only not at their peak but usually decline (and if they don't decline they sure as hell don't shatter their previous best seasons) [/ QUOTE ] Just out of curiosity, are you also suspicious of the majority of other recent HOFers who increased their HR rate at an age when players usually decline? Or just the ones with over 760 homeruns? [/ QUOTE ] The point you're missing is that I don't care about just HR rate. [/ QUOTE ] You're retarded if you think Bonds previous seasons weren't worthy of a top 10 alltime long before the power boost.
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