30/60 QTs

[highlife]

I don't understand why people are busting on this play so much, yeah on first glance it looks stupid but I am fairly sure this is the correct way to play this hand up to the river.

the only question I have is what does the LAG think of Hero's play? Does he see him as a straight forward TAG? In that case you would have much better success with a checkraise on the river.

[dtown_poker]

[ QUOTE ]
In an amazing live Bellagio 30/60 game, Hero limps UTG with Q T. Three more limpers to a smart, thinking LAG who limps otb. The SB completes and the BB checks.

Flop: J 4 4.
Checked around.

Turn: J
Checked to the Button who bets, SB folds, BB folds, Hero check/raises, folded to Button who 3-bets, Hero calls.

River: 5
Check, bet, call.

[/ QUOTE ]

This, this is not good.

[shant]

[ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ]
LOL

[TheMetetron]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ]
LOL

[/ QUOTE ]

Have I mentioned F U lately?

PS - Yes this means you won a hug next time you are in Vegas.

[jason_t]

The responses to this thread were pretty much what I expected them to be. I'm quite frustrated by that.

The Button had 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] and UTG's Q-high took the pot. I think both players played this hand pretty thoughtfully. Dean pretty much nailed what I think that UTG must have been thinking during the hand; I think he played the hand brilliantly. The only problem I have is that the Button, while clearly reading UTG's hand for what it was, spewed chips into what was a tiny pot and then put himself into a spot on the river where he was getting sufficient odds to try bluffing one more time. So on the turn the pot was 3.5 BB and including the 3 BB that UTG put into the pot on the turn he spent 4 BB trying to win those 6.5 BB. That's quite an expensive proposition, especially since UTG's check/raise says either "I slowplayed a monster" or "I know you're full of [censored]." Button should have given up to the turn check/raise but his line of thought on UTG's hand was certainly clairivoyant. He made the right read but acting on it just wasn't worth it. Button was trying too hard to win this pot. We shouldn't forget our goal is to win money, not pots. Sometimes that means just letting go in spots like this even if we're dead certain that our opponent has nothing too.

[Abbaddabba]

When you say it's a "great" game, i tend to think loose-passive. And against a large field of loose passives, i really do hate bluff-raising in a small pot.


It's clear that button doesnt have a jack or a four, but i dont think you can automatically exclude something like a pair of 5's or ace high from 3betting this. If he thinks you're FOS enough to 3bet as a bluff (which is to say, he thinks you have something you may have to fold), he would also think that you're drawing live against his ace high - in which case the 3bet would be for value. By labelling him LAG you sort of imply that he's going to bet any small hole pair on the flop when checked to, but that may not always be the case.


Small pot ... large field ... out of position ... and we dont even know if we're ahead the bettor for certain. While it is higher stakes than ive ever played by quite a bit, a "good" 30/60 live game probably plays quite a bit like my usual online game.

[chisness]

jason,

What if button just calls cr on turn? Hero would then bet riv? Would a raise here work?

[jason_t]

[ QUOTE ]
jason,

What if button just calls cr on turn? Hero would then bet riv? Would a raise here work?

[/ QUOTE ]

Brilliant, imo.

[dtown_poker]

[ QUOTE ]
The responses to this thread were pretty much what I expected them to be. I'm quite frustrated by that.

The Button had 6 9 and UTG's Q-high took the pot. I think both players played this hand pretty thoughtfully. Dean pretty much nailed what I think that UTG must have been thinking during the hand; I think he played the hand brilliantly. The only problem I have is that the Button, while clearly reading UTG's hand for what it was, spewed chips into what was a tiny pot and then put himself into a spot on the river where he was getting sufficient odds to try bluffing one more time. So on the turn the pot was 3.5 BB and including the 3 BB that UTG put into the pot on the turn he spent 4 BB trying to win those 6.5 BB. That's quite an expensive proposition, especially since UTG's check/raise says either "I slowplayed a monster" or "I know you're full of [censored]." Button should have given up to the turn check/raise but his line of thought on UTG's hand was certainly clairivoyant. He made the right read but acting on it just wasn't worth it. Button was trying too hard to win this pot. We shouldn't forget our goal is to win money, not pots. Sometimes that means just letting go in spots like this even if we're dead certain that our opponent has nothing too.


[/ QUOTE ]

Regardless of result, hero loses big money in the long run by playing this way.

[volcano1976]

OMG!!! How can you call that river? More importantly how can you call that turn???