Help -- I have NEVER seen this happen before.

[HossTheBoss]

This relates to this topic, takin from this article-

http://www.pokerineurope.com/pokerar...?articleid=784


"John Juanda showed immense class when holding 910 diamonds and the flop came KK10 as he was about to bet it was noticed that the dealer had not burned a card ( his opponent had A6 diamonds and would probably have folded to a bet on this flop). The flop was destroyed cards shuffled and the flop re dealt resulting in both players picking up a flush draw that hit knocking Juanda out . He said "nice hand" and as the dealer tried to find a hole to fall into Juanda told him " its no problem if it wasn't meant to be it wasn't meant to be" and gracefully left the table. "

[youtalkfunny]

[ QUOTE ]
it was noticed that the dealer had not burned a card...
The flop was destroyed cards shuffled and the flop re dealt

[/ QUOTE ]

Terrible ruling.

[smoore]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
it was noticed that the dealer had not burned a card...
The flop was destroyed cards shuffled and the flop re dealt

[/ QUOTE ]

Terrible ruling.

[/ QUOTE ]

What should happen here?

[El Diablo]

ep.

"FLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

[Rick Nebiolo]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
it was noticed that the dealer had not burned a card...
The flop was destroyed cards shuffled and the flop re dealt

[/ QUOTE ]

Terrible ruling.

[/ QUOTE ]

What should happen here?

[/ QUOTE ]

Let's pretend a floor was called at the proper time. Per the lead post these seem to be the relevant facts:

"Flop is J 8 3

Lady checks, other limper checks, CO bets $20, I raise to $70, Lady pushes all in for ~$150, one fold, CO folds, I call.

Lady turns over Q Q

The turn is 9 and the river is 2, lady says, "Nice hand." "Thanks," I reply, getting ready to rake a pot of about $350.

"Wait a second," the dealer says. "I think I made a mistake. I think I burned one too many before the turn."

Before I can even respond, he turns the turn and river cards face down and fishes two cards out of the muck.

"These are the correct turn and river," he says. And one of the cards he turns over is the Q.

Immediately, the old lady reaches for the pile of chips. "Wait a second, what's going on?" I ask heatedly. "You dealt the turn and river!"

"I know," the dealer responds. "But for some reason I didn't think anyone was betting the flop, so I got ready to deal the turn and I burned one. Then people started betting, and then I burned an extra card when we went to the turn."

If there was no action after the dealer made the mistake (and essentially there wasn't here) AND one could be 100% sure that the cards could be replaced correctly (not sure at all here given the dealer was fishing in the muck) then the floor could fix things.

But even if the correct cards could be clearly identified if action followed the mistake (e.g., there was another better (not all in) involved after the turn) then the mistake is "accepted" by the fact that action followed the mistake. In this case the turn/river cannot be corrected.

~ Rick

[dicelumpY2005]

I am really interested in knowing which dealer this was... I visit all 3 poker rooms in the area quite frequently (Seneca Niagara on the US side, and Fallsview and Casino Niagara on the Canadian side), and the dealers at Seneca Niagara are without a doubt, 100X better than the ones in Canada. I would even go as far as to say they are better than a lot of rooms I've been to in Vegas. I am not doubting the OP, but I seriously am interested in knowing which dealer there would attempt such a thing.

[smoore]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
it was noticed that the dealer had not burned a card...
The flop was destroyed cards shuffled and the flop re dealt

[/ QUOTE ]

Terrible ruling.

[/ QUOTE ]

What should happen here?

[/ QUOTE ]

I figured the floor could fix the mistake in the OP because there was no action. I was unsure whether the board would stand with further action, thanks for clearing that up, ElD.

What's supposed to happen specifically in the Juanda hand?

[youtalkfunny]

Take the three flop cards, and put them back on top of the deck, in their original order. Since the link is from something called "Poker in Europe", and they deal the flop one card at a time on the WPT Paris show, this should be easy. If the dealer spreads the flop, it's still not rocket science to back the cards up to the top of the deck.

Once you've got them back to where they belong, burn and spread a flop. Show everyone the exposed burn card. This keeps the cards in their original order.

All this presumes there was no action on the flop, which is the impression I got from the post.

[smoore]

[ QUOTE ]
Take the three flop cards, and put them back on top of the deck, in their original order. Since the link is from something called "Poker in Europe", and they deal the flop one card at a time on the WPT Paris show, this should be easy. If the dealer spreads the flop, it's still not rocket science to back the cards up to the top of the deck.

Once you've got them back to where they belong, burn and spread a flop. Show everyone the exposed burn card. This keeps the cards in their original order.

All this presumes there was no action on the flop, which is the impression I got from the post.

[/ QUOTE ]

thank you.

[AKHobbes]

I think that this is being blown out of proportion. I would think that most of you 2+2'ers would know that if the dealer truly made the mistake, then the real winning hand would be a set of queens. Just because he awarded the pot doesn't mean it's over. What if a dealer misreads a hand and awards it incorrectly? Do you know how much of a problem this would cause? I understand that the floor and dealer weren't very amicable about it but you have to understand. The dealer does this every day is constantly correcting mistakes. I love the John Juanda approach to this scenario... If you weren't meant to win, well... too bad.