Hypothetical Management Decision re: non-tipping patron of restaurant

[NT!]

i think part of the reason for tips creeping upward is that, in mid-level or nicer places, really good servers can earn more than that. i don't know what it is - more young people going out to eat, change in restaurant culture, who knows - but eventually they start to be disappointed in 15%. not that they hold it against the customer particularly, but they are always trying to make 20% or better, that's what makes them a good server.

well then eventually the less excellent servers start feeling the same way, and wanting to make more than 15% too. i feel like the concept of waiting tables as a real money-making enterprise kind of rose up more and more in the last few decades, and with it, so did the pressure to tip.

might be totally off as i am pretty young, but just from talking to people who have been in the industry for a while and observing things, that's my guess.

[NT!]

btw jbrent is right about big parties or people taking a long time at a table. big parties are way, way, way more of a pain in the neck, and (as we discussed in the other thread) it is like a rule of thumb that if you put 6 guys in a group who are average tippers on their own, at least two of them will short the bill. [censored] obnoxious.

anyone who has ever worked in a kitchen can explain to you how big parties make things harder. you have to get 5 or 6 or 10 plates out all at the same time, all of which are hot and ready to go. this can be especially tough in a small place where you are working on a single range and salad station or a small oven or something. depending on your line size this can mean that basically one party takes up 10-15 minutes of a cook's time which is HUGE in a busy place. if you have a few small parties order directly after them it means they are going to wait at least that much longer for their food.

also if you sit at a place all night, take a long time to order, sit around drinking coffee and tea and stuff, you are monopolizing table space that equals income for servers and for the restaurant. if you are paying for a fine dining experience and want to take your time that's fine, but you better take care of your server as well, because you are costing them money and keeping others from eating. you paid for your food and beverages, you didn't rent a booth for three hours.

[Golden_Rhino]

I have never worked in a restaurant, so bear with me. If a group of 6 guys tips 15% on a $500 tab, that adds up to $75. Assuming that the waiter only has one table (which is unlikely), and those guys hog it all night, is $75 that bad? I mean it would be for ~5 hours, which works out to $15/hour. Not a get rich sum of money, but not horrible either.

[z28dreams]

[ QUOTE ]
I have never worked in a restaurant, so bear with me. If a group of 6 guys tips 15% on a $500 tab, that adds up to $75. Assuming that the waiter only has one table (which is unlikely), and those guys hog it all night, is $75 that bad? I mean it would be for ~5 hours, which works out to $15/hour. Not a get rich sum of money, but not horrible either.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly - the hourly rates most waiters gets paid is pretty retarded for what they do.

And it's nowhere near 5 hours of work - the actual interaction between the waiter and customer is probably less than 15 minutes total.

Out of all the people I have to tip in the world, I think it's waitstaff that I despise tipping the most.

[jaydub]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I have never worked in a restaurant, so bear with me. If a group of 6 guys tips 15% on a $500 tab, that adds up to $75. Assuming that the waiter only has one table (which is unlikely), and those guys hog it all night, is $75 that bad? I mean it would be for ~5 hours, which works out to $15/hour. Not a get rich sum of money, but not horrible either.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly - the hourly rates most waiters gets paid is pretty retarded for what they do.

And it's nowhere near 5 hours of work - the actual interaction between the waiter and customer is probably less than 15 minutes total.

Out of all the people I have to tip in the world, I think it's waitstaff that I despise tipping the most.

[/ QUOTE ]

15 minutes of work for a 5 hour table? Really, you're going with that ratio? You think perhaps there might be some stuff going on behind the scenes?

Rhino,

1. 5 hours is a retarded number for a restaurant
2. Tips are shared, how much depends on the type of place
3. Lead paint chips should not be eaten

J

[jonnyd]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
asking them to leave because they dont tip is ridiculous and the idea of it pisses me off

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sure it does, stiff.

[/ QUOTE ]

actually im a very good tipper

i just think its [censored] that a tip would be required to eat at the restaurant

[z28dreams]

[ QUOTE ]

15 minutes of work for a 5 hour table? Really, you're going with that ratio? You think perhaps there might be some stuff going on behind the scenes?


[/ QUOTE ]

Obviously it's not that low - but let's take a middle of the road restaurant, around $20/head. Party of 6. Let's go long and say the party is there for 2 hours.

With drinks, the bill might come out to $200 or so. At 15%, that's a $30 tip, still averaging $15/hr (and that's assuming the waiter is actually working that full 2 hours and has no other tables.)

It was never uncommon for some of my friends at nicer restaurants to come home with $150 - $200 in their pockets working a 6-7 hour shift.

[jaydub]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

15 minutes of work for a 5 hour table? Really, you're going with that ratio? You think perhaps there might be some stuff going on behind the scenes?


[/ QUOTE ]

Obviously it's not that low - but let's take a middle of the road restaurant, around $20/head. Party of 6. Let's go long and say the party is there for 2 hours.

With drinks, the bill might come out to $200 or so. At 15%, that's a $30 tip, still averaging $15/hr (and that's assuming the waiter is actually working that full 2 hours and has no other tables.)

It was never uncommon for some of my friends at nicer restaurants to come home with $150 - $200 in their pockets working a 6-7 hour shift.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ok, now we're being rational and logical with reasonable numbers. Much better.

Others with industry experience (I have zero) can elaborate on the amounts (which vary) but I do know that the tip is shared among several people so the $15/hr in our discussion is not going to be achieved.

J

[Golden_Rhino]

Jaydub,

I really don't see why I needed to be insulted. I prefaced by saying that I never worked in a restaurant, so anything that I wrote was a layman's view of the whole thing.

Why is 5 hours ridiculous? Too long or too short?

Do servers not make $15/hour? If they don't make at least that much, why not find a better job?

[jaydub]

[ QUOTE ]
Jaydub,

I really don't see why I needed to be insulted. I prefaced by saying that I never worked in a restaurant, so anything that I wrote was a layman's view of the whole thing.

Why is 5 hours ridiculous? Too long or too short?

Do servers not make $15/hour? If they don't make at least that much, why not find a better job?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah you do.

J