Incident in Jena,La.

[CutCreator]

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@Taso

The outrage (at least my outrage) has nothing to do with these young men being arrested for beating another young man. Regardless of what the victim said, I hope we all agree that a beating is not justified and the perpetrators should be punished. The problem is in the apparent inequality in punishment meted out to black and white people in this town.

<ul type="square">[*]Black student attack white student = attempted 2nd degree murder[*]White man pulls gun on black students = theft of a fire arm by the black students[*]White students/townsfolk beat black students at a party day(s) before white student is beaten = no action taken[*]16 year old black student found guilty of attempted 2nd degree murder in adult court by a jury of all white "peers"[*]Reports of intimidation by DA toward black students[/list]Maybe we're just getting one side of the story. Maybe a town with a white's only shade tree is progressive enough that it's justice system doesn't have underlying threads of racism. Maybe the town uses nooses as decoration all the time and this symbolic act was simply misconstrued by the black students. Obviously we'll never know absolutely all of the details, but this smacks of prejudice that pervades to all levels of this town's society and that is more than enough evil for me to become upset.

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EXACTLY ON POINT. These are the real facts and issues. I'd be interested to see anyone justify these charges.

[RedBean]

[ QUOTE ][*]White students/townsfolk beat black students at a party day(s) before white student is beaten = no action taken

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A few more details...the black victim was beaten with beer bottles by his white attackers, and the DA declined to press charges against all of them except one offender.

He was charged with MISDEMEANOR SIMPLE ASSUALT...for beating a black kid with a beer bottle.

Days later, black teens beat the white kid up, using NO WEAPONS, and are charged with aggravated assault and attempted murder.

Same DA, same town, same groups of people flaring up over the same racial tension that bore out of the noose incident.

Only they are treated vastly different on the basis of the color of their skin.

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White man pulls gun on black students = theft of a fire arm by the black students

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This one was particulary ridiculous. A white adult, a Jena High alum, confronted three black Jena students with a shotgun and attempted to scare and harass them....they fought back, subdued him, disarmed him, and then fled.

The DA considered filing charges against the three youths for "stealing" the firearm.

Ludicrous.

[Taso]

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[ QUOTE ][*]White students/townsfolk beat black students at a party day(s) before white student is beaten = no action taken

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A few more details...the black victim was beaten with beer bottles by his white attackers, and the DA declined to press charges against all of them except one offender.

He was charged with MISDEMEANOR SIMPLE ASSUALT...for beating a black kid with a beer bottle.

Days later, black teens beat the white kid up, using NO WEAPONS, and are charged with aggravated assault and attempted murder.

Same DA, same town, same groups of people flaring up over the same racial tension that bore out of the noose incident.

Only they are treated vastly different on the basis of the color of their skin.

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White man pulls gun on black students = theft of a fire arm by the black students

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This one was particulary ridiculous. A white adult, a Jena High alum, confronted three black Jena students with a shotgun and attempted to scare and harass them....they fought back, subdued him, disarmed him, and then fled.

The DA considered filing charges against the three youths for "stealing" the firearm.



Ludicrous.

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He CLAIMED he was beaten with beer bottles, hit in the head, etc, yet never went to a hospital or a doctor. No marks of stitches. You get hit in the head with a beer bottle, you need stitches.

And the gun situation is so clouded, the way I've been hearing it, it's hard to know exactly what happened there. But the police made their charges based on eye witness testimony.

[RedBean]

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He CLAIMED he was beaten with beer bottles, hit in the head, etc, yet never went to a hospital or a doctor. No marks of stitches.

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The white victim in the "attempted murder" case CLAIMED to have been beaten within inches of his life, despite showing up at a school dance 2 hours afterwards.

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You get hit in the head with a beer bottle, you need stitches.


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Touche...if you get beaten to within inches of your life, you don't be going to school dances two hours later.

Beer bottle or not:

White attackers + black victim = misdemeanor simple assault
Black attackers + white victin = felony attempted murder

Same DA, only days apart, stemming from the same racial tensions....wildly different results, based solely on skin color.

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And the gun situation is so clouded, the way I've been hearing it, it's hard to know exactly what happened there. But the police made their charges based on eye witness testimony.

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Why doesn't the same "cloud" of doubt or reliance on eyewitness testimony exist for the Jena 6?

No one knows for sure what happened during the beating either, but since they are black, it doesn't matter.

Only when the attackers are white, the police have to be certain?

Of the 44 eyewitnesses interviewed on the beating, none of them could agree on who the attackers even were...only that they were black.

That was good enough for the cops, and good enough for the DA, and apparently good enough for you.

[Taso]

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He CLAIMED he was beaten with beer bottles, hit in the head, etc, yet never went to a hospital or a doctor. No marks of stitches.

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The white victim in the "attempted murder" case CLAIMED to have been beaten within inches of his life, despite showing up at a school dance 2 hours afterwards.

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You get hit in the head with a beer bottle, you need stitches.


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Touche...if you get beaten to within inches of your life, you don't be going to school dances two hours later.

Beer bottle or not:

White attackers + black victim = misdemeanor simple assault
Black attackers + white victin = felony attempted murder

Same DA, only days apart, stemming from the same racial tensions....wildly different results, based solely on skin color.

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And the gun situation is so clouded, the way I've been hearing it, it's hard to know exactly what happened there. But the police made their charges based on eye witness testimony.

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Why doesn't the same "cloud" of doubt or reliance on eyewitness testimony exist for the Jena 6?

No one knows for sure what happened during the beating either, but since they are black, it doesn't matter.

Only when the attackers are white, the police have to be certain?

Of the 44 eyewitnesses interviewed on the beating, none of them could agree on who the attackers even were...only that they were black.

That was good enough for the cops, and good enough for the DA, and apparently good enough for you.

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I didn't hear one of the protestors today argue that the people didn't beat the kid up, they argued that he shouldn't be charged with a crime because its racist to charge black people with crimes. (Kidding here, obviously)

The white victim, by the way, was unconciouss and hospitalized as a result.

The "cloud" I was referring to wasn't to the testimony, it was to the story. According to wikipedia (and the court transcript), the white person left the scene and was followed to his car where he picked up a weapon. In an act of self defense, this is totally justified. &lt;This is all very vague though, but it does indicate that whitey was acting in self defense, and the eye witness testimony seems to corroborate this.

[RedBean]

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I didn't hear one of the protestors today argue that the people didn't beat the kid up, they argued that he shouldn't be charged with a crime because its racist to charge black people with crimes. (Kidding here, obviously)


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Protesters aside, if you were familiar with the trial, you'd hear his defense attorney argue it, and you'd see an all-white jury of his 'peers' discard it completely and convict.
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The white victim, by the way, was unconciouss and hospitalized as a result.


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It was "claimed" he was knocked unconcious, and his "hospitilization" amounted to an emergency room visit to treat minor cuts and abrasions.....released with a few band-aids and was at the school dance two hours later.

Notice how when the black victim claimed he was beaten by a beer bottle, you questioned the veracity and discarded it....yet when a white victim claims he was unconcious, it is somehow viewed as gospel truth?

Why is that?

What makes you inherently more trusting of one over the other, especially considering all you know about them is skin color?

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According to wikipedia (and the court transcript), the white person left the scene and was followed to his car where he picked up a weapon. In an act of self defense, this is totally justified. &lt;This is all very vague though, but it does indicate that whitey was acting in self defense, and the eye witness testimony seems to corroborate this.

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The eyewitness testimony of his fellow white acquaintences, sure, I bet it does support it.

The eyewitness testimony of the black victims says something entirely different.

Odd how you choose to believe one and discard the other.

Either way, indisputable facts in evidence show that the shotgun was registered to the white assailant, but the vehicle belonged to one of his friends.

How many people keep their guns in other people's cars?

Seems far more likely a trio of hillbilly's piled in the car and brought the gun along to harass some black youths, and had to weasel their way out with the nice little cover story once they got disarmed and rebuffed.

[Low Key]

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The white victim, by the way, was unconciouss and hospitalized as a result.


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It was "claimed" he was knocked unconcious, and his "hospitilization" amounted to an emergency room visit to treat minor cuts and abrasions.....released with a few band-aids and was at the school dance two hours later.

Notice how when the black victim claimed he was beaten by a beer bottle, you questioned the veracity and discarded it....yet when a white victim claims he was unconcious, it is somehow viewed as gospel truth?

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Well, I wouldn't say "gospel truth", but the few reports I've read said he was sent to the hospital for the 6 man beat down, and only the beer bottle fellow claims to have been hit over the head. I didn't read any of his friends agreeing with this or any eye witnesses.

This part of the discussion has nothing to do with skin color. All we have to go off of is what we've read. Which is hard enough to trust as it is.

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According to wikipedia (and the court transcript), the white person left the scene and was followed to his car where he picked up a weapon. In an act of self defense, this is totally justified. &lt;This is all very vague though, but it does indicate that whitey was acting in self defense, and the eye witness testimony seems to corroborate this.

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The eyewitness testimony of his fellow white acquaintences, sure, I bet it does support it.

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I think the gun incident had to be culled together from eye witness accounts because all those involved had stories that differed too greatly. I can only assume the police talked to the people who saw what happened on an individual basis. This being the case, it's safe to assume that what was reported was actually what happened. Because, if 5 people said he was followed to the car, and a sixth said they were beating him while he was making his way to the car, it's pretty obvious who's not being honest. But again, I don't know the police's interrogation tactics, so I can't be sure of what really happened.

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Seems far more likely a trio of hillbilly's piled in the car and brought the gun along to harass some black youths, and had to weasel their way out with the nice little cover story once they got disarmed and rebuffed.

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Nice that you're so racist against white people with this particular conspiracy theory, but again, the testimony of those involved in this incident, as I've read, was disregarded because of inaccuracies/disparities.

[Taso]

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What makes you inherently more trusting of one over the other, especially considering all you know about them is skin color?


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The fact that one actually went to a hospital for his injuries, which were verified, and the other claims he was severely beaten, yet has no hospital statement to back him up. Don't even consider skin color here, are you telling me one of these doesn't sound more credible than the other?

As for the shotgun thing again, this is exactly why I said it was cloudy. All we have to go one are eye witness testimony, which, by the way, lean heavily my way. But I'm not saying that makes it fact, I'm saying its essentially useless to discuss, because we can't really guess here what happened.

With the actual assaults, we can use hospital documents to give us a better idea of what happened.

[MuresanForMVP]

RedBean, in the previous incident at the party there were 5 black males and an unknown (to me) number of white males. Thats hardly 6 vs. 1. And if you read recounting of the shotgun incident it seems that a white male encountered Bell and "several friends", and an "incident ensued". It seems reasonable that an argument took place and the white student felt threatened given the whole "several friends" aspect of it and he went to retrieve his firearm. IMO you're way off on this one RedBean, along with that Cut guy

[MuresanForMVP]

I kind of grunched the previous 30 (long ass) posts, but I thought one of the biggest points the protesters had was the fact that the three who put the nooses up didn't get charged with anything. At least, in all the discussions I've seen that is hearkened back to time and time again. This link explains a good deal, including the fact that the FBI was called into Jena to investigate the "hate crime" aspect of the nooses. It was decided that all the aspects of a hate crime were there, but the offenders were all minors, and there was no backdrop criminal organization like the KKK to justify making it a federal matter. As such they left it to the school to decide.

As has been said before, the shotgun incident is extremely cloudy, and I could see how a single individual could feel threatened by a number of assailants, but I dont understand the theft of the firearm charge much either. This is pretty obviously the most likely thing to have been completely botched, but there's something that I'm curious about. Why is there never any mention made of Bell's 4 prior violent crimes of which he was convicted? at the time of the 6 vs. 1 he was still on probation? This kid seems to be a piece of trash, and pieces of trash tend to get the book thrown at them in court (see:OJ in his upcoming trial).