Yet another NYC raid

[FireStorm]

Exactly what I'm talking about. This is the same disjointed logic used by drug addicts, tax evaders, guys who crack up g/f's who cheat on them, and whomever else feels that "their" crime is the one that is victimless. Please know that I am not equating any of the above to poker, clearly these are more serious infractions. However, the law is the law, and it says you cannot have a poker room for the purpose of profit. Owners know the laws when they open these venues, and they know the risks/penalties involved. Open one, live with the consequences.

The commentary on not busting it up because more serious stuff is going on is absurd. Police don't have the right to simply ignore crimes as they please. Many of these clubs are flaunting their existence - emails, business cards, cars parked suspiciously at all hours of the night, etc etc. Police do not exist for the purpose of going out and deciding that XYZ crime isn't serious, so they will ignore it. Do you suggest that they simply let it go on? Doesn't speak much for their credibility, does it?

[sivadom]

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Police don't have the right to simply ignore crimes as they please.

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I think this a common misconception, and, really, at the heart of what is wrong with the role of police in society. Laws are hard and fast if applied, but when and how often they are is another matter altogether, especially for relatively minor offenses. How many times have we all passed a radar trap travelling in slight excess of the speed limit, only to have the cop ignore us and wait for a 'bigger' offender? Many. The same principle applies at a higher level when the sergeant/commisioner/mayor/whoever motivates those under him to target specific crimes above others. The reasons can range from politics to need for greater ticket revenue to seeming personal whim. Giuliani's crackdown on jaywalking, anyone? Waaay OT, but just my 2c.

[FireStorm]

You make a decent point and this is something I thought of previously, but these are not offenses which carry potential jail times or have long term effects.

[*TT*]

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You make a decent point and this is something I thought of previously, but these are not offenses which carry potential jail times or have long term effects.

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you work in NJ rooms. Do you know the guys at the soccer club? They did time, it my my boy Jose miserable (which if you know Jose is hard to believe, he is always happy). My friend has a case in the NYC system now, his outlook isn't good, they are hoping for a shorter term penalty but its likely he will see the inside of a cell for a bit.

whatever you do, don't downplay the facts - working in these rooms are a great risk, far greater than playing.

[FireStorm]

Please reread. The above cut and paste actually has less than zero to do with poker rooms. It is in reponse to the person above me talking about jaywalking and speeding. I have posted about such risks two or three dozen times recently, so clearly I am aware and not going to downplay risks of working.

Jose's name has been thrown around quite a bit. I don't know him personally. This was about a year and change before I became involved over there. Nobody involved with me did jail time or anything close to it, albeit one person is still on the lam.

[CincyLady]

Why not take this opportunity and instead of complaining about the raids, work with your state representives to create a bill to change your states contitution to allow for card rooms, and have it put on the next ballot?

I'm sure there are enough poker players in NY that would be more than willing to sign a petition to have such a law/change to the NY Constitution put onto the ballot, that would allow for card rooms in NY (like they are in California).

[Mattyspin]

Jose is in fact a very decent guy. Very amiable, but lending $$$$ and other business practices exercised at the soccer club are what caused him to do time.

one thiing i'll always remember about Jose is that he'd never turn his back on anyone who worked with/for him. unfortunately, that ended up hurting him legally from what i heard.

[*TT*]

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Jose is in fact a very decent guy. Very amiable, but lending $$$$ and other business practices exercised at the soccer club are what caused him to do time.

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thats what caused him to do longer time, his partners were in the clink too. Jose's problem was with his other businesses in addition to the Soccor Club which just compounded the problems - NJ is one of the toughest in the nation when it comes to illegal gambling.

[*TT*]

[ QUOTE ]
Why not take this opportunity and instead of complaining about the raids, work with your state representives to create a bill to change your states contitution to allow for card rooms, and have it put on the next ballot?

I'm sure there are enough poker players in NY that would be more than willing to sign a petition to have such a law/change to the NY Constitution put onto the ballot, that would allow for card rooms in NY (like they are in California).

[/ QUOTE ]

everybody sing with me... Daydream Believer....

The state is lobbying to get casinos on reservations and that didn't work out too good, that is a much bigger priority for them than Poker is especially since the Governor was part of the poker crackdown when he was the most powerful AG in the nation.

bad news, it wont happen. California was a fluke due to the court system, it wasn't legislated, and since that time California has adjusted their laws to keep new rooms from oepning.

[CincyLady]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why not take this opportunity and instead of complaining about the raids, work with your state representives to create a bill to change your states contitution to allow for card rooms, and have it put on the next ballot?

I'm sure there are enough poker players in NY that would be more than willing to sign a petition to have such a law/change to the NY Constitution put onto the ballot, that would allow for card rooms in NY (like they are in California).

[/ QUOTE ]

everybody sing with me... Daydream Believer....

The state is lobbying to get casinos on reservations and that didn't work out too good, that is a much bigger priority for them than Poker is especially since the Governor was part of the poker crackdown when he was the most powerful AG in the nation.

bad news, it wont happen. California was a fluke due to the court system, it wasn't legislated, and since that time California has adjusted their laws to keep new rooms from oepning.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, as for me, I don't live in NY, but all I was trying to say, was that instead of complaining about how the law is, why not try to work as a group to get the existing laws changed?

I don't know of any state in the union, where a citizen can NOT work to get a proposed law put onto the books by way of ballot.

Many people simply work with someone who knows how to write law (IE: Their State Rep), then go out and get enough signatures of registered voters, to put the proposed law on the ballot.

If enough people in that state then want for it to happen, they will vote for the law to pass, and it will become the (new) Law.

With poker as popular is it is today, I'm really surprised more people don't use this approach to get Card Rooms leagalized in their state.

Many people view poker differently these days, than they do Casino Gambling. Where as a law allowing for Casinos might not be voted in, one that would allow for Card rooms just might.

BTW ... I love the song Daydream believer! [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

I might also point out that ... If not for many 'Daydream believers' putting action to their 'daydreams', we wouldn't even have this wonderful country called the United States of America.