JJ Overplayed?

[aK13]

I'm not thrilled about capping preflop, but maybe I'm the minority. I would probably just flat call.

[tyler_cracker]

the last time we had a pf situation like this with JJ, the cool kids wanted to fold.

as played, flop and turn are standard.

we can't over-overcall the river, even in this giant pot. is this a bet from TT and a call from AK and, um, 99/88/6x?

[marchron]

<nit>88 has us whaled.</nit>

[Shillx]

the last time we had a pf situation like this with JJ, the cool kids wanted to fold.

Huh? We fold JJ for 3 cold (sometimes) but not in the situation that this hand presents. That said I would tend to just call unless I felt like I could collect some dead money by capping it (doesn't seem too likely).

edited

[ESKiMO-SiCKNE5S]

ya i call pf...

the rest is fine.

James - the potential benefit of checking the river is having a scared weak Q check it down as well, the chances of a Q not being out there are pretty low

[James.]

[ QUOTE ]
James - the potential benefit of checking the river is having a scared weak Q check it down as well, the chances of a Q not being out there are pretty low

[/ QUOTE ]

if we are assuming our opponents are passive enough to play a Queen like this and not valuebet it on the end when checked to, why can't we assume they will call with worse hands than our JJ?

that said my real point is if we plan on calling a bet on the river we need to put it there ourself. if we think the situation dictates a c/f, then it's fine not to bet.

if these opponents are weak enough to play a Queen like this, when a bet goes in on the river we are less of an underdog to their range if we place it ourselves. it's a common strategy of mine OOP in big-pot play versus weak/passive opponents to valuebet somewhat thin on the end.

i repeat, c/f is fine also, but if we are considering calling a bet we are in a more profitable situation placing it ourself.

[Zilarik]

PF I'd rather call to see if MP caps it. I could find a fold only if SB is a nit, though. Coldcalling 3 seems like the ickiest thing you can do but we have a solid reason for doing so here.