Can someone explain the health care 'crisis' to me?

[pokerbobo]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
A few problems here.... Doctors will be paid a set amount for procedure X. Govt will increase this amount with inflation year after year like is done with almost all govt budget items. Problem: There is no incentive to improve on procedure X. In a capitalist system, procedure Y and Z can be created that may improve results and or lower cost of procedure. In a govt program, who is going to improve on procedures or lessen costs when it nets out as a loss in income. The capitalist program provides this incentive by competition, whereas any improvements to treatment or lower costs can be marketed to provide greater income to doctors and provide lower costs and better care to patients.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think there's a couple of problems with this kind of thinking (although generally speaking you have a point).

First of all, if doctors are being paid $300 (as per government regs) for procedure X, and procedure X takes an hour to do and a $5,000 piece of equipment, then they are very incentivized to discover innovative ways to do the procedure in 15 minutes and/or with a piece of $1,000 equipment.

Secondly, many medical innovations are done by research physicians who are 1) compensated via salary by their facility and 2) are interested in research more than patient care. Making the market for medical services competitive will not necessarily drive frontline doctors to start a research lab in their basements on weekends.

Finally, medical services "don't work like" consumer goods. Certainly, many doctors are in it for the money, but conversely many doctors are in health care because they care about health care. Now, they're not immune to financial pressures, but there is a real cultural difference between doctors and, say, bond traders. That is to say, creating financial incentives for doctors doesn't have the same effect is does for commissioned sales people.

[/ QUOTE ]

We could also imprison a-holes like John Edwards who sue doctors into bankrupcy and raise malpractice premiums sky high. He has destroyed lives, and increased more risky C section deliveries because of his lawsuits. Some docs are so scared now, they grab the scapel way before they should just because of the legal fear he has created.

John Edwards is a criminal, who got rich by putting wealth ahead of truth. Anyone who thinks he is "for the little guy" is dumb, uninformed, lying to themselves, or all of the above.

[mjkidd]

Anyone who thinks medical malpractice lawsuits are a big problem in this country is dumb, uninformed, lying to themselves, or all of the above.

[pokerbobo]

[ QUOTE ]
Anyone who thinks medical malpractice lawsuits are a big problem in this country is dumb, uninformed, lying to themselves, or all of the above.

[/ QUOTE ]

Right....Doctors leaving the practice because the high insurance premiums caused by BS lawsuits, and the multi million dollar settlements awarded by idiotic juries is not a problem.

Putting pregnant women at greater risk by increasing the number of C-sections so John Edwards can live in a 30000 square foot home is not a problem. I have no problem with Edwards being rich, but to earn your money in a fraudulant way as he did, makes him no different than a thief to me.

The mentality of the masses in America is that all doctors are multi millionaires. The judgements levied against docs have been huge in many cases.

I generally dont think real highly of docs in respect to quick and accurate diagnosis, but in this case they are really getting screwed hard with no lube.

[bdk3clash]

Public Citizen: "Medical Malpractice Lawsuits Not the Cause of Health Care 'Crisis,' Public Citizen Report Shows"

[ QUOTE ]
Despite claims by business and medical lobbying interests and the Bush administration, there is no medical malpractice lawsuit crisis in America, according to analysis released today by Public Citizen. The new report, “The Great Medical Malpractice Hoax,” dispels oft-repeated myths of dwindling doctors and spiraling insurance premiums used to support limits on the ability of injured patients to seek redress in the courts.

The real problems are a lack of attention to patient safety, the high incidence of preventable medical error and the lack of accountability for a small set of doctors who account for a majority of medical malpractice payments, the report reveals.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
According to the analysis [of data from federal government’s National Practitioner Data Bank (NPDB)], the total number of malpractice payments paid on behalf of doctors, with judgments and settlements, declined 15.4 percent between 1991 and 2005, and the number of payments per 100,000 people in the country declined more than 10 percent. In addition, the average payment for a medical malpractice verdict, adjusted for inflation, dropped eight percent in the same period.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
“Despite assertions by the medical and business lobbies that physicians are leaving practice because of burdensome malpractice lawsuits, the number of doctors is increasing faster than the population,” said Laura MacCleery, director of Public Citizen’s Congress Watch group. “In recent years, medical malpractice insurers have been reaping huge profits, not paying out excessive jury awards. The false claims of a malpractice lawsuit crisis are really about putting profits ahead of patients. They distract from real health care reform designed to improve patient safety, enhance efficiency and cut costs.”

[/ QUOTE ]

[owsley]

That link doesn't prove anything because it doesn't break down the malpractice claims sector by sector. Malpractice claims in one area of medicine might have declined considerably in one area because of improving technology and training but risen in another totally different area.

[pokerbobo]

[ QUOTE ]
That link doesn't prove anything because it doesn't break down the malpractice claims sector by sector. Malpractice claims in one area of medicine might have declined considerably in one area because of improving technology and training but risen in another totally different area.

[/ QUOTE ]

It doesn't forgive Edwards for being a fraudulant donk-hole either. (or others like him)

[Dan.]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
That link doesn't prove anything because it doesn't break down the malpractice claims sector by sector. Malpractice claims in one area of medicine might have declined considerably in one area because of improving technology and training but risen in another totally different area.

[/ QUOTE ]

It doesn't forgive Edwards for being a fraudulant donk-hole either. (or others like him)

[/ QUOTE ]

Substantive. Nice work.

[mjkidd]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Anyone who thinks medical malpractice lawsuits are a big problem in this country is dumb, uninformed, lying to themselves, or all of the above.

[/ QUOTE ]

Right....Doctors leaving the practice because the high insurance premiums caused by BS lawsuits, and the multi million dollar settlements awarded by idiotic juries is not a problem.

Putting pregnant women at greater risk by increasing the number of C-sections so John Edwards can live in a 30000 square foot home is not a problem. I have no problem with Edwards being rich, but to earn your money in a fraudulant way as he did, makes him no different than a thief to me.

The mentality of the masses in America is that all doctors are multi millionaires. The judgements levied against docs have been huge in many cases.

I generally dont think real highly of docs in respect to quick and accurate diagnosis, but in this case they are really getting screwed hard with no lube.

[/ QUOTE ]

Show me some outrageous malpractice judgements. Show me some stats detailing an increase in maternal mortality in the past 15 years.

Why do you think that doctors shouldn't be held financially accountable for their mistakes? If a doctor makes an honest -- but negligent -- mistake, isn't their patient due some monetary compensation?

And by the way, most doctors are multi-millionares. The lowest-paid doctors make about 200k a year. If you don't think the average net worth of an American physician is >2 million, you're crazy.

[owsley]

[ QUOTE ]
If you don't think the average net worth of an American physician is >2 million, you're crazy.

[/ QUOTE ]

that is just so wrong

doctors dont start practicing until their 30s, when they typically have 6 figures of debt. when they get the school debt paid off... time to pay for kids! not to mention taxes and relocating costs, etc. nowhere close.

[mosdef]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If you don't think the average net worth of an American physician is >2 million, you're crazy.

[/ QUOTE ]

that is just so wrong

doctors dont start practicing until their 30s, when they typically have 6 figures of debt. when they get the school debt paid off... time to pay for kids! not to mention taxes and relocating costs, etc. nowhere close.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is correct. Don't forget overhead for a private practice, if applicable. If doctors were all multi-millionaires they wouldn't have to apply for small business loans.

Having said that, they are still in the top quartile of earners.