*******OFFICIAL Ravens vs Colts Thread*******

[VarlosZ]

[ QUOTE ]
They were horrible this year due to injuries. They are playing better in the playoffs now that they're healthy. It seems as if you're agreeing with me that they were either average or above average the past few years...thats all I was ever saying. I wasn't saying they were great, just that they weren't horrible.

[/ QUOTE ]

Including this year, Manning's been to the playoffs seven times. Again including this year, his defense has been terrible five of those seven years. It's not a 'myth created by Manning supporters' that he's had terrible defenses -- it's a fact.

EDIT: Ok, in fairness not all of those five years were "terrible" for the defense. A couple of them were merely bad.

[Scary_Tiger]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
They were horrible this year due to injuries. They are playing better in the playoffs now that they're healthy. It seems as if you're agreeing with me that they were either average or above average the past few years...thats all I was ever saying. I wasn't saying they were great, just that they weren't horrible.

[/ QUOTE ]

Including this year, Manning's been to the playoffs seven times. Again including this year, his defense has been terrible five of those seven years. It's not a 'myth created by Manning supporters' that he's had terrible defenses -- it's a fact.

[/ QUOTE ]

Despite having statistically awful regular season defenses, they haven't exactly cost the team games in the playoffs.

Points allowed by Colts defense in Postseason:

6 - 2006 Ravens (#12 in NFL)
8 - 2006 Chiefs (#15 in NFL)
21 - 2005 Steelers (#9 in NFL)
20 - 2004 Patriots (#4 in NFL)
24 - 2004 Broncos (#9 in NFL)
24 - 2003 Patriots (#12 in NFL)
31 - 2003 Chiefs (#1 in NFL)
10 - 2003 Broncos (#10 in NFL)
41 - 2002 Jets (#15 in NFL)
23 - 2000 Dolphins (#16 in NFL)
19 - 1999 Titans (#7 in NFL)

Aside from 2002, it's hard for me to put much blame on the Colts defense for not winning the Super Bowl.

[VarlosZ]

[ QUOTE ]
Despite having statistically awful regular season defenses, they haven't exactly cost the team games in the playoffs.

Points allowed by Colts defense in Postseason:

6 - 2006 Ravens (#12 in NFL)
8 - 2006 Chiefs (#15 in NFL)
21 - 2005 Steelers (#9 in NFL)
20 - 2004 Patriots (#4 in NFL)
24 - 2004 Broncos (#9 in NFL)
24 - 2003 Patriots (#12 in NFL)
31 - 2003 Chiefs (#1 in NFL)
10 - 2003 Broncos (#10 in NFL)
41 - 2002 Jets (#15 in NFL)
23 - 2000 Dolphins (#16 in NFL)
19 - 1999 Titans (#7 in NFL)

Aside from 2002, it's hard for me to put much blame on the Colts defense for not winning the Super Bowl.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're right, at least to a large extent. Two things, though. First, while the defense hasn't flat out cost the Colts playoff games by being so awful that the offense can't keep up, they certainly weren't winning any games for the Colts, either. Up until this year, they've generally put up average at best performances, so when the offense has an off day (which is bound to happen from time to time against playoff teams), there was never a chance of the Colts winning a defensive struggle.

Second, the defense has been so bad for so long, yet the Colts have made the playoffs seven of the past eight years. Is there any chance they make it more than once or twice in that span with an average QB instead of Manning? In order to succeed in the postseason, you first have to get there, and with that in mind Peyton Manning has contributed more to his team's playoff success than any player in the last decade (with the likely exception of Tom Brady).

[Richard Tanner]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Despite having statistically awful regular season defenses, they haven't exactly cost the team games in the playoffs.

Points allowed by Colts defense in Postseason:

6 - 2006 Ravens (#12 in NFL)
8 - 2006 Chiefs (#15 in NFL)
21 - 2005 Steelers (#9 in NFL)
20 - 2004 Patriots (#4 in NFL)
24 - 2004 Broncos (#9 in NFL)
24 - 2003 Patriots (#12 in NFL)
31 - 2003 Chiefs (#1 in NFL)
10 - 2003 Broncos (#10 in NFL)
41 - 2002 Jets (#15 in NFL)
23 - 2000 Dolphins (#16 in NFL)
19 - 1999 Titans (#7 in NFL)

Aside from 2002, it's hard for me to put much blame on the Colts defense for not winning the Super Bowl.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're right, at least to a large extent. Two things, though. First, while the defense hasn't flat out cost the Colts playoff games by being so awful that the offense can't keep up, they certainly weren't winning any games for the Colts, either. Up until this year, they've generally put up average at best performances, so when the offense has an off day (which is bound to happen from time to time against playoff teams), there was never a chance of the Colts winning a defensive struggle.

Second, the defense has been so bad for so long, yet the Colts have made the playoffs seven of the past eight years. Is there any chance they make it more than once or twice in that span with an average QB instead of Manning? In order to succeed in the postseason, you first have to get there, and with that in mind Peyton Manning has contributed more to his team's playoff success than any player in the last decade (with the likely exception of Tom Brady).

[/ QUOTE ]

If you say the reg season is a sort of Pre-Post season, then yeah Manning has done a ton. However, it's not really fair to say that as it doesn't really apply. Manning hasn't dominated a game in the Post season as much as he does in the regular season. The idea that it's playoff jitters is silly as the Broncs and Cheifs games have been in the playoffs. If you say "well they aren't good teams" then we get the real reason, sometimes good teams make it tougher to win. Funny thing that.

Cody

[VarlosZ]

I agree.

[Assani Fisher]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Despite having statistically awful regular season defenses, they haven't exactly cost the team games in the playoffs.

Points allowed by Colts defense in Postseason:

6 - 2006 Ravens (#12 in NFL)
8 - 2006 Chiefs (#15 in NFL)
21 - 2005 Steelers (#9 in NFL)
20 - 2004 Patriots (#4 in NFL)
24 - 2004 Broncos (#9 in NFL)
24 - 2003 Patriots (#12 in NFL)
31 - 2003 Chiefs (#1 in NFL)
10 - 2003 Broncos (#10 in NFL)
41 - 2002 Jets (#15 in NFL)
23 - 2000 Dolphins (#16 in NFL)
19 - 1999 Titans (#7 in NFL)

Aside from 2002, it's hard for me to put much blame on the Colts defense for not winning the Super Bowl.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're right, at least to a large extent. Two things, though. First, while the defense hasn't flat out cost the Colts playoff games by being so awful that the offense can't keep up, they certainly weren't winning any games for the Colts, either. Up until this year, they've generally put up average at best performances, so when the offense has an off day (which is bound to happen from time to time against playoff teams), there was never a chance of the Colts winning a defensive struggle.

Second, the defense has been so bad for so long, yet the Colts have made the playoffs seven of the past eight years. Is there any chance they make it more than once or twice in that span with an average QB instead of Manning? In order to succeed in the postseason, you first have to get there, and with that in mind Peyton Manning has contributed more to his team's playoff success than any player in the last decade (with the likely exception of Tom Brady).

[/ QUOTE ]
I think its possible. Their offensive weapons with Manning, Wayne, and before this year Edge would've made them a top 5 offense with an average QB imo. With Peyton they've probably been the best offense over that time span(don't feel like looking it up, but I'd be shocked if they weren't at least top 3).

[Assani Fisher]

Jamal Lewis only carried the ball 4 times in the second half. He was running very well. McNair was sucking. Makes no sense to me. Look at the play by play:

Baltimore - 10:52
1st-10, BAL34 10:52 S. McNair incomplete pass to the left
2nd-10, BAL34 10:48 S. McNair passed to M. Clayton to the left for 19 yard gain
1st-10, IND47 10:23 S. McNair incomplete pass to the right
2nd-10, IND47 10:19 BAL committed 9 yard penalty
2nd-19, BAL44 9:50 S. McNair passed to D. Mason down the middle for 9 yard gain
3rd-10, IND47 9:06 S. McNair passed to M. Clayton to the left for 6 yard gain
4th-4, IND41 8:30 S. Koch punt, no return


Baltimore - 5:43
1st-10, BAL5 5:43 S. McNair sacked by J. Thomas
2nd-10, BAL5 5:11 S. McNair passed to O. Mughelli to the left for 9 yard gain
3rd-1, BAL14 4:27 O. Mughelli rushed up the middle for 3 yard gain
1st-10, BAL17 3:44 IND committed 5 yard penalty
1st-10, BAL22 3:18 J. Lewis rushed to the left for 8 yard gain
2nd-2, BAL30 2:41 M. Anderson rushed up the middle for 3 yard gain
1st-10, BAL33 2:03 S. McNair passed to T. Heap down the middle for 23 yard gain
1st-10, IND44 1:15 S. McNair passed to J. Lewis to the right for 13 yard gain
1st-10, IND31 1:15 BAL committed 5 yard penalty
1st-15, IND36 0:06 J. Lewis rushed up the middle for no gain

4th Quarter
Baltimore continued
2nd-15, IND36 15:00 BAL committed 10 yard penalty
2nd-25, IND46 14:30 S. McNair passed to D. Mason down the middle for 7 yard gain
3rd-18, IND39 14:30 S. McNair passed to M. Anderson to the left for 6 yard gain
4th-12, IND33 13:03 M. Stover kicked a 51-yard field goal


Baltimore - 12:03
1st-10, BAL39 12:03 S. McNair incomplete pass to the left
2nd-10, BAL39 11:58 S. McNair incomplete pass to the left
3rd-10, BAL39 11:53 S. McNair passed to M. Clayton down the middle for 21 yard gain
1st-10, IND40 11:13 J. Lewis rushed to the right for 1 yard gain
2nd-9, IND39 10:31 S. McNair incomplete pass to the right
3rd-9, IND39 10:18 N. Harper intercepted S. McNair for 9 yards


Baltimore - 8:43
1st-10, BAL27 8:43 J. Lewis rushed to the right for 2 yard gain
2nd-8, BAL29 7:57 S. McNair incomplete pass down the middle
3rd-8, BAL29 7:53 S. McNair incomplete pass to the right
4th-8, BAL29 7:39 S. Koch punt. T. Wilkins returned punt for 2 yards


Baltimore - 0:13
1st-10, BAL33 0:13 S. McNair sacked by R. Mathis. S. McNair fumbled. R. Mathis recovered fumble


Thats what lost us the game imo.

[Jack of Arcades]

eh, Lewis managed about 4 decent runs (8, 9, 13, 18) but the rest of the time he was getting stuffed.