Party Responds - Hilarity Ensues

[MicroBob]

Naturally it's more hands per hour.
You are contributing more per hand also of course because it's only 5.4 average players per hand as opposed to 9.2 players per hand
(thus you are getting back a smaller percentage per hand...since, in this promo, the amount you get per hand is fixed).

My pokertracker stuff:

3/6 full = 73 hands an hour. 55% raked = 40 raked per hour
3/6 6-max = 94 hands an hour. 49% raked = 46 raked per hour


your mileage may vary.

[Perseus]

Bob

I got the same reply. Mine is also pretty impossible for me to hit so I too was a little disappointed they are not reworking the deal. It makes financial sense, however, for them to not change anything about their bonus program so I would have been shocked if they did.

Though you are a player who now will not play as much, many will look at these slightly unreachable goals and just put in more time at the tables. In the grand scope of things, the players who will play more outweigh the few who won't try and get any of the bonus.

This bonus, in my opinion, is overall the best they have shown for the VIP club...and I say this as someone who probably won't hit more than 1 week. Maybe they are improving?

Jon

[sourbeaver]

Here's mine:

Dear Raphael,

Thank you for contacting us.

I would like to take this opportunity to thank you for sending us your feedback on February's promotion. This will be passed on to the concerned department who will analyze your feedback and take it into consideration for future offers.

This offer has been made to you based on your level of play in the previous months. Go ahead and try your very best in achieving the targets set. Surely you will see that if you do reach the target for the 8 weeks it will all be worth it at the end of the day.

I wish you the best of luck and hope you have a nice day.

Should you require further assistance, our Customer Care Department is available 24/7 to assist you via email.

Thank you for choosing us as your online gaming site!

Alfred
VIP Club
Customer Care

[MicroBob]

I am playing other high-RB and high-bonus sites though where I'm making upwards of 15-20 cents per hand (or more).

And I also don't get 'punished' for playing 6-max (on Party...you contribute more rake on 6-max...but you still only get credit for the same amount of points).

So if I do well on 6-max on these other sites then you can start pushing more than 20 cents per hand fairly easily.


The games at Party are still quite good though of course and 21% actually does make it tempting.


Here are a couple other factors:


1. With all these offers out there I think the games will tighten-up somewhat.
The 3/6 full tables (I don't agree with those who complain that they are too too tight at party) will have quite a few 2+2-type, whoring VIP's populating them even more now.


Games will still be decent of course, you just can't get rid of all the fish...but they probably will not be quite as fabulous.


2. I don't get anything for only getting part-way to the goal.

I value my flexibility as an online-player and don't like to think of it as HAVING to put in hours on a given day.

Example: GF and I are having a little Valentine's get-away on Monday-Tuesday.
I don't want to try to cram in my 46 hours of 6-tabling (or whatever) before we go.
I could do it of course. But why?


- I can play just 25-30 hours on my other sites if I prefer.
- probably make more in rake-back and bonuses (40-70%)
- I can play only 2 or 3 tables at a time if I felt like it (instead of practically being obligated to play 5-6 tables at all times, even when tired, to even have a chance of hitting the party bonus)


This last one is pretty important to me.
In the November VIP targets I went crazy with too many tables to try to get all my points in.

I ran bad, then I started playing really bad, and it began an awful downward spiral of losing, losing, losing...that I, at least, partly attribute to just trying to play more tables than I should have.

So this is a slightly dangerous situation for me.
chasing after the stupid carrot by playing way too much and too many tables...and consequently not playing well at all.


Online-poker is supposed to be fairly relaxing if I want it to be.


I also just resent Party essentially telling me, "you have to play 46 hours on 6 tables in order to receive your 21% return. Otherwise you get nothing."
"(oh...and btw....we're giving people we like better than you 50% or higher for only 10 hours per week)."


I have other sites saying, "Play as little or as much as you want and you'll still get your 35-70% (or higher) in RB and bonuses."


anyway, thanks for the numbers on AP.
You got me thinking again about my other semi-similar sites that I haunt.


Again, the games at Party are so fishy (plus PT and PA-HUD compatability) that I'll still be debating this decision.

Sorry for those who are bored with my ramblings on this.
I'm glad I was able to read some other things on 2+2 that helped me come to some conclusions.


I do think that for a not-very-good player like myself it is important to analyze these types of incentives in such detail so as to come to the right decision about whether it has appropriate value in your given situation or not.


Hopefully someone out there also learned a little something from my detailed analysis of 'should Bob do his party offer or not?'

[4thstreetpete]

Bob, I got the exact form email response from James Wahnon. All he did was just changed the numbers. Mine is also impossible to hit and I sent them some really angry emails.
He had the audacity to tell me I 'only' had to play 4 tables of 30/60 for 30 hours a week to hit my target. [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] Now reading your email, I get a chuckle to see he mentions you to play 6 tables for 50 hours a week. Unfreaking real.

I emailed them to let them know that high volume players are getting screwed because they took my best week and upped my target. This whole target aimed bonii has left a very bad taste in my mouth.
They have just pissed me off for the last time. I will not attempt the target when there are so many other sites out there with better bonuses for me. They've essentially lost a huge chunk of my business for at least the next 8 weeks.

[MrMon]

Interesting point about you wanting a higher rake structure if you're a tight player. I'm going to have to think about it offline, but except in rare circumstances, I don't think that works. Especially if you aren't collecting rake at Party. Let me work on this one.

Rake is collected at Absolute $3/6 starting at $10, they take $0.50, and another $0.50 at $20. Bonus is triggered by that first rake, so it's actually a plus. No flop, no drop though.

Average pot has been $29.81. 85.5 hands per hour. AP $3/6 6 max is not tight at all. LAA and sLAA predominate. Passives are very rare.

[LinusKS]

Something you didn't mention, but might also want to consider, is burn-out. If you get sick of poker, you run the risk of not playing at all.

Once poker stops being fun, you might as well have a job. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[lumpy19]

[ QUOTE ]
I am playing other high-RB and high-bonus sites though where I'm making upwards of 15-20 cents per hand (or more).

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you answered your own question.

I'm with you on this, I still haven't reached a point where RB can even come close to bonuses. Then again I'm a casual player who puts in maybe 10-15 hours/wk at 3/6 and 5/10 full.

[MicroBob]

Well...you don't actually JUST want a higher rake structure.


It's just that you would prefer to get the same amount in rake-back than you would an equivilent rake-reduction.


I an just nitting against those who say, "that site's rake is 10% less....and that's just as good as 10% rake-back" because it isn't.


Obviously you don't JUST want a higher rake (especially if you aren't getting rake-back).
And you shouldn't really PREFER that a site have more rake just to get more rake-back returned.


I'm just saying that reduced rake is NOT the same as just getting rake-back.

The only way it would be the same is if they directly returned the rake to you on only the pots that YOU won.


Think of it this way:
100% rake-back would be better for you then a site that didn't have any rake at all (which would be a 100% rake-reduction I guess).


You could make a profit by just playing super-tight and collecting the full MGR of all the hands you are not involved in.


Hypothetical:
Lets say the rake on every hand on a 10-player table is $1 and you are getting 100% rake-back.
Thus, you are earning $0.10 per hand in rake-back.

After 100 hands you have won 8 pots.
So the house took away $8 in rake from those pots that you won.

but in rake-back you are earning $10 returned in the same 100 hands.

you will be doing this over and over.


as a TAG you are not winning your fair-share of the total number of pots (you are playing tighter, and winning less than 1/10 of the pots on a 10-player table).

So rake-back on the pots that everybody else is contesting is preferred to just getting reduced rake on the pots that you win.


Hope I cleared up my position on this a little bit.

[morphd]

[ QUOTE ]
I am playing other high-RB and high-bonus sites though where I'm making upwards of 15-20 cents per hand (or more).

[/ QUOTE ]

Huh? Where and at what limits? Is this a propping deal?