Player Discussion

[El Diablo]

If 2+2 has incorrect material printed in their books, I would surely expect a correction/errata, especially if they vehemently defended that advice.

[Larry David]

[ QUOTE ]
If 2+2 has incorrect material printed in their books, I would surely expect a correction/errata, especially if they vehemently defended that advice.

[/ QUOTE ]

[Stefan_K]

if this mason malmuth has discussed poker to all the 'real pros' that he has known for 20 years, why can't he let them answer if he has all his bussy time fixing the 2+2 printer... please mason confess that you were compleatly off in this disscussion insteed of just dissapering....

[Mason Malmuth]

Let me try one more time. There is no question the jacks are the better hand. But at the point in time the question is asked, the jacks want the ace-queen suited to fold because the expectation for the ace-queen suited is positive from this point on out which means the jacks lose money from that point on. I have made this clear in my other posts.

The expectation equation needs to be started from the point in time that the question was asked. If you choose to start the expectation equation from the beginning of the problem then it will show that the jacks are the profitable hand and the ace-queen suited is not.

In othe words, someone else would gladly take over Player A's position (he holds the ace-queen suited) from that point on if he didn't have to put in the original $40, and that was the point of my answer.

As for the jacks, they have made in this hand more money than what the ace-queen suited will make from this point on because they have already made this money. Remember if the ace-queen suited folds as they should, and no one else plays, the jacks gets the $55 already in the pot.

I don't see how it can be more clear than this.

MM

[El Diablo]

Mason,

You are horribly wrong here and continue to give bad advice. I hope you ask David or Ed or someone to help you understand this question.

You have stated that AQ is the better hand here.

At the time this question is posed, give someone the option to take either AQ or JJ.

IF THEY TAKE JJ, THEY MAKE $40.

IF THEY TAKE AQ, THEY MAKE $15.

The question is not whether or not someone would take the AQ hand if given the choice to do so. It makes $15, of course they would.

The question is not whether or not JJ would prefer the AQ hand to fold, as he makes $15 more if it does.

THE QUESTION YOU POSED WAS, AT THIS POINT, GIVEN THESE ASSUMPTIONS, WHICH HAND IS BETTER.

Or, as you have stated in your latest post, WHICH HAND WOULD A PLAYER RATHER TAKE OVER FROM THIS POINT.

HOW ON EARTH CAN YOU CONTINUE TO ASSERT THAT SOMEONE WOULD BE BETTER OFF TAKING OVER THE AQ HAND THAN TAKING OVER THE JJ HAND?

[BobboFitos]

[ QUOTE ]
Let me try one more time. There is no question the jacks are the better hand. But at the point in time the question is asked, the jacks want the ace-queen suited to fold because the expectation for the ace-queen suited is positive from this point on out which means the jacks lose money from that point on. I have made this clear in my other posts.

[/ QUOTE ]

No, thats not the question. Your question was which position is it better to be in, and it's clearly the jacks.

Not would you rather fold or call with AQ. If you demonstrate, which you did/others did, AQ is pos EV, it's better then folding.

So, all of us would rather have the jacks, but we'd rather have AQ fold.

[El Diablo]

[ QUOTE ]
Let me try one more time. There is no question the jacks are the better hand. But at the point in time the question is asked, the jacks want the ace-queen suited to fold because the expectation for the ace-queen suited is positive from this point on out which means the jacks lose money from that point on. I have made this clear in my other posts.

The expectation equation needs to be started from the point in time that the question was asked. If you choose to start the expectation equation from the beginning of the problem then it will show that the jacks are the profitable hand and the ace-queen suited is not.

In othe words, someone else would gladly take over Player A's position (he holds the ace-queen suited) from that point on if he didn't have to put in the original $40, and that was the point of my answer.

As for the jacks, they have made in this hand more money than what the ace-queen suited will make from this point on because they have already made this money. Remember if the ace-queen suited folds as they should, and no one else plays, the jacks gets the $55 already in the pot.

I don't see how it can be more clear than this.

MM

[/ QUOTE ]

Mason,

After reading my response to your post, please answer this simple question.

At the point you ask the question, which hand would you rather take over?

I suspect you will then rethink your position in this entire thread.

[lapoker17]

You know Mason's pissed when he doesn't say "Best Wishes".

[El Diablo]

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You know Mason's pissed when he doesn't say "Best Wishes".

[/ QUOTE ]

If anyone has reason to be pissed in this thread, it's me, but I'm not even pissed, just disappointed.

[mikech]

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[ QUOTE ]
You know Mason's pissed when he doesn't say "Best Wishes".

[/ QUOTE ]

If anyone has reason to be pissed in this thread, it's me, but I'm not even pissed, just disappointed.

[/ QUOTE ]
i think you guys are arguing semantics at this point. mason's said his wording about which hand is "better" was poorly formulated, he's now just claiming that calling the reraise is +ev. yes, he had to concoct a case using tortured logic and dubious assumptions, as well as retreating from that aforementioned wording, but i don't see how there's any point left in grilling him anymore.