Black Jack Ettiquete: Am I rude?

[*TT*]

I don't play blackjack, so my explanation could be off. But from my understanding this is why you were given a hard time. If I am wrong or used the wrong terminology, someone else please jump in. I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned this yet:

The player may have been counting (or he thought he was counting which seems to be more common). Counters wait for a shoe that is "rich" in tens so they have more favorable odds. They will manipulate their bet size when they are getting the best of it, but in order for them to know they have this advantage they must also assume their fellow players are practicing basic strategy or their count can be off. So if they suddenly go from $100 a hand to $500 its because the conditions are now favorable, but one extra card requested, or if you split a hand that normally shouldn't be split might mess with their ability to catch that ten. Yes its a lot of voodoo, but at least there is a modest amount of math behind their superstition.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

[jba]

TT,

you make valid points, counters dont like extra players eating cards in a high count. on the other hand counters don't sit at full tables very often, and the # of bad BJ players that believe a new player "messes up the flow of the cards" outnumber counters about 10000000000:1. maybe I'm exaggerating but it's close.

[*TT*]

[ QUOTE ]
TT,
the # of bad BJ players that believe a new player "messes up the flow of the cards" outnumber counters about 10000000000:1. maybe I'm exaggerating but it's close.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are probably not exaggerating. Isn't it amazing how everyone who plays BJ knows how to count yet their basic strategy always is wrong?

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

[Mustafa]

If I'm counting a shoe and the count is getting high toward the middle of that shoe and the dealer let you in, I would simply ask the dealer not to let you in until the next shoe and spout off something superstitious. I had to play through the -EV hands to get the shoe high, and I don't need you coming in late and helping me burn through the extra tens and aces faster. If I "earned" the high count (via playing through the lousy count), I would like to reap the benefit of the +EV I paid for. I wouldn't be rude, but I would certainly ask, and I wouldn't hesitate to buy your $5 match play from you.

Not all blackjack players are idiots, but even the good ones pretend to be from time to time. It's really not that much different from acting in poker.

[Gotmilk]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't play blackjack, so my explanation could be off. But from my understanding this is why you were given a hard time. If I am wrong or used the wrong terminology, someone else please jump in. I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned this yet:

The player may have been counting (or he thought he was counting which seems to be more common). Counters wait for a shoe that is "rich" in tens so they have more favorable odds. They will manipulate their bet size when they are getting the best of it, but in order for them to know they have this advantage they must also assume their fellow players are practicing basic strategy or their count can be off. So if they suddenly go from $100 a hand to $500 its because the conditions are now favorable, but one extra card requested, or if you split a hand that normally shouldn't be split might mess with their ability to catch that ten. Yes its a lot of voodoo, but at least there is a modest amount of math behind their superstition.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

This has nothing to do with it. They are just superstitious goons. But that doesn't mean they don't deserve respect.

[MicroBob]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't play blackjack, so my explanation could be off. But from my understanding this is why you were given a hard time. If I am wrong or used the wrong terminology, someone else please jump in. I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned this yet:

The player may have been counting (or he thought he was counting which seems to be more common). Counters wait for a shoe that is "rich" in tens so they have more favorable odds. They will manipulate their bet size when they are getting the best of it, but in order for them to know they have this advantage they must also assume their fellow players are practicing basic strategy or their count can be off. So if they suddenly go from $100 a hand to $500 its because the conditions are now favorable, but one extra card requested, or if you split a hand that normally shouldn't be split might mess with their ability to catch that ten. Yes its a lot of voodoo, but at least there is a modest amount of math behind their superstition.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]


TT - Most of the time the player who mentions this was NOT counting.
I used to count-cards and also dealt for a few months.

Naturally I can recognize superstitious players who are mostly just plain bad.

100% of the time when I have seen someone complain about this type of thing it was because they were a superstitious player (although they may play something kind of close to basic-strategy).

I would say that my sample-size for this 100% is somewhere over 100 occurances (not for specifically using a coupon, but just players complaining about others jumping in and out of the game).


To address another point about 'everyone thinks they can count':
Most players I have experienced know very little about even basic counting. They think it's too difficult for a normal human-being this side of rain-man to be successful at.

A few might understand something about it being a way to monitor the ratio of 10's to low-cards. But many of these people are the same types who will take 'even money' on their BJ against an ace up-card (an incorrect play in a neutral-count deck) or think that taking insurance on a good hand is a smarter play (especially bad when you have 2 face-cards).


Most people just don't get counting AT ALL.
Perhaps this is a bit different at the locals-type casinos in LV than it is in Tunica.

But my experience playing blackjack at one of the less-touristy casinos in LV was that the players were just as bad as anywhere else. Except that, unlike the casinos on the strip populated with more tourists, the locals were not completely new to the game.

[El Diablo]

jba,

"the # of bad BJ players that believe a new player 'messes up the flow of the cards' outnumber counters about 10000000000:1. maybe I'm exaggerating but it's close."

No, that is exactly correct. It also happens to be the same ratio for "third-base hitting when he should stay will take the dealer's bust card guys" to counters.