Sticky Showdown Conundrum – I’m genuinely confused!

[Rick Nebiolo]

3-5 blind NL game at a B&M casino in LA. A few players limp for $5 and Player A in the SB raises to about $15 or so. Player B (UTG) and a couple of other limpers call.

Flop comes A-x-x. Player A bets out about $30. Player B raises to $60 or so. All other players fold. Player A (about $250 deep) quickly re-raises “all-in”. Player B (about $230 deep) goes into a short “tank” and calls. Turn and river are two blanks.

Note that using the latest Los Angeles/nationwide rule (if no river action, showdown starts clockwise from the button) or the old Las Vegas rule (if no river action, last aggressor from a previous round shows first) Player A is supposed to show his hand first. This isn’t in dispute for the purposes of this post.

Player A asks: “What do you have?”

Player B responds: “I called your all-in raise.”

Player A repeats: “What do you have?”

Player B continues: “With no river action, the showdown starts clockwise from the button.”

(Note that the dialog above and below was a bit more colorful, but I’ll keep it “Dragnet style” for the purposes of this post) [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Player A says: “I’ve got a pair”, still holding his cards face down.

Now Player B says one of two things (which one is in dispute, if you think it matters, state why):

Player B version 1: “Per the showdown rules you are required to show first.” (or something very similar)

Player B version 2: “Show me”

Instead of showing down, Player A now bullet mucks his cards. The dealer stacks off the all-ins, pushes this part of the pot to Player B (who is still protecting his hand) and now starts to push the remaining part of the pot (the pre-flop action) to Player B.

Player A now asks: “I want to see that hand.”

Note that if Player B had bullet folded after Player A mucked, this post wouldn’t even have been written. However, Player B is the careful type who wants possession of the pot before he releases his hand. Also note that if a third party dealt in had asked to see Player B’s hand, he would clearly have to show it under the existing “IWTSTH” rules.

Anyway, Player B responds: “How can you ask to see my hand given you didn’t show me yours when you were required to show first?”

Player A repeats, “I want to see your hand”.

Player B asks for a decision regarding whether he has to show his hand from a nearby floorman who wasn’t very busy. When the floorman comes, the facts are explained as above (though in short form).

You are the floorman. What is your decision under your cardroom’s existing rules?

Bonus. If you are uncomfortable with the rule you had to apply, how would you change it?

I won’t be going out today until 1:00 pm PST, so I’ll post a little follow up and a related post later.

All comments appreciated.

~ Rick