Entering call down mode too early ?

BubbleMint · #1 10-16-2007, 03:00 PM

SB has been playing his position well, I couldnt imagine him raising into the limpers without a PP or AJ+, then the flop C/R indicates strength, doesnt it ?

Full Tilt 2/4 Hold'em (6 handed) Full Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP checks, 1 fold, Button calls, SB raises, Hero 3-bets, MP folds, Button calls, SB calls.

Flop: (11.50 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, Button calls, SB raises, Hero calls, Button calls.

Turn: (8.75 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)

SB bets, Hero calls, Button calls,

River: (13.75 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)

SB bets, Hero calls, Button folds.

Final Pot: 13.75 BB

KitanaiCALL · #2 10-16-2007, 03:59 PM

his range is pretty polarized here given the action and you're only beating KK or TT. A person would have to be sick in the head to play those hands in this manner which seems to be highly unlikely given the description of the player. For this reason i believe that a calldown is in order.

Absolution · #3 10-16-2007, 04:10 PM

[ QUOTE ]
his range is pretty polarized here given the action and you're only beating KK or TT. A person would have to be sick in the head to play those hands in this manner which seems to be highly unlikely given the description of the player. For this reason i believe that a calldown is in order.

[/ QUOTE ]

He doesn't have those hands. The hands that he can have that you beat are AQ and ATs. He probably doesn't have AK. You lose to AJ and A9s (he seems to think that this is unlikely). There are a lot more combinations of AQ/ATs than AJ. He might also play QTs this way. I think you are about 50/50 on the flop against his range. With the other player in the pot I think you have to 3-bet this on the flop. The other player does a couple things for you:

1) Provides extra money so you can leverage your equity edge, even though you probably don't have one against the SB.
2) Makes the SB play more honest since you likely aren't fooling around here.

Gurravasa · #4 10-16-2007, 04:15 PM

[ QUOTE ]
his range is pretty polarized here given the action and you're only beating KK or TT. A person would have to be sick in the head to play those hands in this manner which seems to be highly unlikely given the description of the player. For this reason i believe that a calldown is in order.

[/ QUOTE ]

we also beat QJ, but anyway I think calldown is the correct balance between risk and reward

Gurravasa · #5 10-16-2007, 04:19 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The hands that he can have that you beat are AQ and ATs.

[/ QUOTE ] we lose to AQ...

sharpie · #6 10-16-2007, 06:22 PM

With the 3rd player in I think you should 3 bet the flop. HU I would just calldown. Once I didn't 3 bet the flop I like the calldown on the turn, that card makes our hand weaker.

Absolution · #7 10-16-2007, 08:08 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The hands that he can have that you beat are AQ and ATs.

[/ QUOTE ] we lose to AQ...

[/ QUOTE ]

Flop.

bigmac366 · #8 10-16-2007, 09:26 PM

i call the flop check raise planing to raise the turn..... well any turn but that. i think calling down here is fine considering the river doesnt improve you much.

frenchpignouf · #9 10-17-2007, 10:06 AM

[ QUOTE ]
With the 3rd player in I think you should 3 bet the flop. HU I would just calldown. Once I didn't 3 bet the flop I like the calldown on the turn, that card makes our hand weaker.

[/ QUOTE ]

We can't give a cheap draw with huge implied odds to a GS on the flop.