ZeeJustin the next to get caught multi accounting Party MTTs

[hecubus]

http://www.cardplayer.com/audio/thecircuit.php

A short discussion about online cheating (Matusow and Huff) with brief mention of ZJ and JJ. About 4:10 in.....

Day 2 stream w/ Gus Hansen.

[August West]

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ZJ has a post linked in the anthology thread. I find it hard to take anything this cheater says as credible, so maybe it's time for an anthology thread update.

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No need to update, ZJ post was a good one, that's the reason why it's up there in the anthology.

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Yes, be upset at ZJ for what he did, but it is -EV to try and banish him from the 2+2 community. He knows a lot about poker. He writes well. He could have a lot to contribute in the future. All his posts are peer reviewed. If anything is bogus or intentionally misleading it would immediately be pointed out.

So let's not cut off our noses to spite our faces. He made a mistake. I am sure he regrets this more then anyone can imagine. I think he should be encouraged to continue posting in the future after a bit of a cooling off period.

[Mempho]

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ZJ has a post linked in the anthology thread. I find it hard to take anything this cheater says as credible, so maybe it's time for an anthology thread update.

[/ QUOTE ]

No need to update, ZJ post was a good one, that's the reason why it's up there in the anthology.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, be upset at ZJ for what he did, but it is -EV to try and banish him from the 2+2 community. He knows a lot about poker. He writes well. He could have a lot to contribute in the future. All his posts are peer reviewed. If anything is bogus or intentionally misleading it would immediately be pointed out.

So let's not cut off our noses to spite our faces. He made a mistake. I am sure he regrets this more then anyone can imagine. I think he should be encouraged to continue posting in the future after a bit of a cooling off period.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good to hear from you ZJ.

[hecubus]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ZJ has a post linked in the anthology thread. I find it hard to take anything this cheater says as credible, so maybe it's time for an anthology thread update.

[/ QUOTE ]

No need to update, ZJ post was a good one, that's the reason why it's up there in the anthology.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, be upset at ZJ for what he did, but it is -EV to try and banish him from the 2+2 community. He knows a lot about poker. He writes well. He could have a lot to contribute in the future. All his posts are peer reviewed. If anything is bogus or intentionally misleading it would immediately be pointed out.

So let's not cut off our noses to spite our faces. He made a mistake. I am sure he regrets this more then anyone can imagine. I think he should be encouraged to continue posting in the future after a bit of a cooling off period.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good to hear from you ZJ.

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lol, nh.

I just don't understand why a player who is revered to be *that good* has to resort to cheating - it just doesn't add up, and I'm sure some can understand the skepticism regarding his touted skills.

[August West]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ZJ has a post linked in the anthology thread. I find it hard to take anything this cheater says as credible, so maybe it's time for an anthology thread update.

[/ QUOTE ]

No need to update, ZJ post was a good one, that's the reason why it's up there in the anthology.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, be upset at ZJ for what he did, but it is -EV to try and banish him from the 2+2 community. He knows a lot about poker. He writes well. He could have a lot to contribute in the future. All his posts are peer reviewed. If anything is bogus or intentionally misleading it would immediately be pointed out.

So let's not cut off our noses to spite our faces. He made a mistake. I am sure he regrets this more then anyone can imagine. I think he should be encouraged to continue posting in the future after a bit of a cooling off period.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good to hear from you ZJ.

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I am not Justin, but I am a friend of his. I do want to remain anonymous because I don't anyone to suggest that I was doing what he was doing as they did with Curtains. That was totally uncool and I don't want to deal with that sh**.

[jb9]

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it is -EV to try and banish him from the 2+2 community

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I don't know why, but this reminded me of the scene in Shakespeare's Henry IV where Falstaff is trying to convince Prince Harry not to abandon him in the future (when social pressure will make their friendship a problem for Harry).

I suppose this thread can survive one more useless post, so here it is (note: this scene appears in Kenneth Branagh's excellent film version of Henry V):

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Falstaff: But to say I know more harm in him than in myself were to say more than I know. That he is old (the more the pity) his white hairs do witness it; but that he is (saving your reverence) a whoremaster, that I utterly deny. If sack and sugar be a fault, God help the wicked! If to be old and merry be a sin, then many an old host that I know is damn'd. If to be fat be to be hated, then Pharaoh's lean kine are to be loved. No, my good lord. Banish Peto, banish Bardolph, banish Poins; but for sweet Jack Falstaff, kind Jack Falstaff, true Jack Falstaff, valiant Jack Falstaff, and therefore more valiant being, as he is, old Jack Falstaff, banish not him thy Harry's company, banish not him thy Harry's company. Banish plump Jack, and banish all the world!

Prince Harry: I do, I will.

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[August West]

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lol, nh.

I just don't understand why a player who is revered to be *that good* has to resort to cheating - it just doesn't add up, and I'm sure some can understand the skepticism regarding his touted skills.

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You have a right to be skeptical. I guess I can't blame you for that. But I think his posts on poker speak for themselves. They have been well written and well reasoned out. Many of the top player/posters here agree with that. I do too. Please read them all over and if you find faults with them, post them in the relevant discussions. I think you will be hard pressed to find many errors.

He didn't have to resort to cheating. It was a lapse in judgement. I know I had them when I was his age. I think this is kind of typical of kids his age. They often want success really quickly so they push it a little.

Also it has come out in this post that *many* other top players did the same thing, it's just they haven't been caught yet. (And probably won't now.) (and some quite a bit older then Zee.)

[jb9]

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I am not Justin, but I am a friend of his.

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FWIW, if you haven't read it already, there is a long discussion related to this topic (forgiveness and Justin's future involvement with the forum) in NVG (link).

In summary:

Some people hate him forever and nothing will change that.

Some people might be willing to give him a second chance if and only if he apologizes, does what he can to make amends (which may or may not include returning funds in some fashion), and shows signs of remorse, understanding, and intention to never break/bend rules of this sort again.

There are a few people who think he has suffered enough and should just be forgiven now, but they were loudly shouted down.

P.S. If Indy had only started that discussion here, the longest thread record would have been guaranteed -- although I'm sure OOT would have rallied and recaptured the title.

[August West]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
it is -EV to try and banish him from the 2+2 community

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know why, but this reminded me of the scene in Shakespeare's Henry IV where Falstaff is trying to convince Prince Harry not to abandon him in the future (when social pressuire will make their friendship a problem for Harry).

I suppose this thread can survive one more useless post, so here it is (note: this scene appears in Kenneth Branagh's excellent film version of Henry V):

[ QUOTE ]
Falstaff: But to say I know more harm in him than in myself were to say more than I know. That he is old (the more the pity) his white hairs do witness it; but that he is (saving your reverence) a whoremaster, that I utterly deny. If sack and sugar be a fault, God help the wicked! If to be old and merry be a sin, then many an old host that I know is damn'd. If to be fat be to be hated, then Pharaoh's lean kine are to be loved. No, my good lord. Banish Peto, banish Bardolph, banish Poins; but for sweet Jack Falstaff, kind Jack Falstaff, true Jack Falstaff, valiant Jack Falstaff, and therefore more valiant being, as he is, old Jack Falstaff, banish not him thy Harry's company, banish not him thy Harry's company. Banish plump Jack, and banish all the world!

Prince Harry: I do, I will.

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Far from useless. Way to elevate the thread! If only all posts quoted Shakespeare! (or were required to!! LOL)

[TomHimself]

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P.S. If Indy had only started that discussion here, the longest thread record would have been guaranteed -- although I'm sure OOT would have rallied and recaptured the title.

[/ QUOTE ] it was but was moved