Coaching WARNING

[nation]

dan bitel,

it's an ethics question. the right thing to do is work it out instead of keeping the cash. also, those chat logs are really really bad. he sounds very unprofessional.

[AbreuTime]

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FWIW, I've spoken to snowbank on AIM. I really feel bad for him that not enough people have defended him and that loads of people (typical 2p2 mentality) are jumping to conclusions here and trashing his name without just cause at all.

I know he's going to reply here shortly, so I don't really want to say too much about it, but IMO, with regards to the orig poster, its pretty obv that snowbank is in the right and OP in the wrong. OP signed up for a set amount of lessons for a set price. He doesnt have the right to a refund just because he wants one....thats pretty obvious.

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So about the last 3 hours of lessons, he still paid for them, right? He can sell them to someone interested in them, you would agree? Even though I think OP is a moran, I dont think snowbank should ignore him unless he would rather just refund the money and be done with him.

[TheWorstPlayer]

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FWIW, I've spoken to snowbank on AIM. I really feel bad for him that not enough people have defended him and that loads of people (typical 2p2 mentality) are jumping to conclusions here and trashing his name without just cause at all.

I know he's going to reply here shortly, so I don't really want to say too much about it, but IMO, with regards to the orig poster, its pretty obv that snowbank is in the right and OP in the wrong. OP signed up for a set amount of lessons for a set price. He doesnt have the right to a refund just because he wants one....thats pretty obvious.

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Dan, I also think that Snowbank is a good guy and have defended his POV both in this thread and in the original one. I also think that he does not have any obligation to give the money back. However, it is also clear to me (and to other experienced coaches like JT and TC and Krantz and others) that it would have been nicer (and much better for him in the long run) for him to have done so.

[Dan Bitel]

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I think it's revealing that multiple people have come forward with similar negative experiences being coached by him.

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by mutiple you mean 1?

[nation]

im pretty sure aislephive didnt have a good one either.

[Keyser.]

OP + wrschultz who could never get ahold of him and received poor coaching + aislephive = 3

[goofyballer]

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I got coaching from Snowbank a while back, and I wasn't very impressed at all and got little out of it. I "signed up" for like 4-5 hours but I only used 2. I only sent him $$ for the first session of two hours and that was it. I didn't actively pursue finishing our lessons and that was that.


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I told you so.

LOL at anyone paying $150/hr to get coached by snowbank. I'm sure he can do a really good job teaching you what you want to raise pre flop, and whether you want to raise the flop or the turn with your set.

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I hope snowbank responds to the quality of the coaching that wrschultz received in the IM logs he provided, because paying $150/hour for that is just sorry. I had a session with Big_Jim where he came over to my apartment (or he could do the same over Skype; why someone would pay hundreds of dollars get coaching over AIM, which is probably the worst possible vehicle to do sweating over, baffles me) and we reviewed a 1 hour video I made of my play; he had a ton of thoughts on almost every hand I got involved in and we spent almost 2.5 hours going over the 1 hour video. I'm really happy with how that session went, and for snowbank to be charging $150/hr to kinda-but-not-really pay attention on AIM sounds like total [censored].

[AbreuTime]

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I think it's revealing that multiple people have come forward with similar negative experiences being coached by him.

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by mutiple you mean 1?

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You may have missed Aislephive's post, but him and wrshultz have posted about receiving coaching from snowback.

[Dan Bitel]

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dan bitel,

it's an ethics question. the right thing to do is work it out instead of keeping the cash. also, those chat logs are really really bad. he sounds very unprofessional.

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I believe he IS going to try and work it out....but thats for him to say, not me. However, I certainly understand snowbank's restraint in that his name has been dragged through the mud here by OP, after not really doing anything wrong at all to OP. And OP DID imply at the beginning that losing BR was correllated to sb's coaching.

As for teh question of ethics, I was a tennis coach until very recently, and we had similar deals. Pay X for Z lessons. If half way through the course some1 didn't want the rest of lessons b/c he wanted to give up tennis (basically what is happening here) then I wouldn't give nay of the money back, and I think thats 100% OK ethically, as would all the other coaches at the various clubs I was at, where this situation came up.

[Surf]

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I just want to vouch for snowbank since a bunch of dorks who don't know anything about him keep spouting off their opinions. I met snowbank thru Bill Ivey when Bill recommended I use him for rakeback. Snowbank sat on the phone with me for seriously 3 hours trying to figure out how to get me rakeback on PP. I didn't even know this guy and he was sending me 2k+ a month in rakeback with almost nothing in it for him.

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You know that your affiliate gets a cut of your RB, right?

Anyway, I have no opinion on how good of a player / coach snowbank is, and the only thing I have to go on wrt his moral character is how he's acted in this little blowup. He should def be given a chance to tell his side, and I only reacted so strongly because in my eyes SB had conducted himself unprofessionally, and at that point the majority of the responses in the thread were of the "lol buyer beware too bad" variety.



Surf