limpers & button

[tehox]

I think calling >> raising with A10o in this situation. Our PF equity edge is not that big, it doesn't play well in big multiway pots, and I really really want to be bet into on a ten high flop.

[tehox]

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Hand 3: It could be because I suck post-flop and can't let go, but I think I just limp this.. The problem is the possibility of domination from a passively played AJ, AQ, or even AK.

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IMO this is an argument for folding vs. calling/raising, not really for call vs. raise. I would fold here if one or two of the limpers were tight but had low PFR %.

[Buzz-cp]

I bump my own thread cuz it's the zhiznitz.

[FUJItheFISH]

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I've been wondering about pre-flop play from the button on some of these hands when there are already several limpers at LPP tables. I'm also weaning myself off the hand charts. The hands below are those I would be raising with with less limpers, but they leave me wondering about their EV against many players. So, I am left uncertain whether to raise or just call. Please forgive me if I'm missing the most obvious play--I'm still learning!

(all 9 handed)
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Hand 1:
Preflop: Hero is button with 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
5 limpers, Hero ???.

raises
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Hand 2:
Preflop: Hero is button with 10[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
4 limpers, Hero ???.

id raise this if the blinds are super loose and i know they are coming along. otherwise i just overlimp.
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Hand 3:
Preflop: Hero is button with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
4 limpers, Hero ???.

i think this hand sucks since .5/1 passives can easily limp AJo and AQo but then again they can limp JTo and KTo so i think it is up to the hero and what he thinks the best action is. id say limp 50% raise 50%.
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Hand 4:
Preflop: Hero is button with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
4 limpers, Hero ???.

raises

Edit: typo

[/ QUOTE ]

[Aaron W.]

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Hand 1:
Preflop: Hero is button with 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
5 limpers, Hero ???.
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[/ QUOTE ]

This is the only one that's remotely interesting to me. The others all seem to have very straight-forward answers. I haven't played in games that loose in a long time (perhaps only those few times I've played in live games). 5 limpers sounds about right for a raise, perhaps with any pocket pair (if there's a cutoff somewhere, it's right around 77). This is one of those things that I've never thought through completely and have simply taken on faith from the advice of many others who have come through this way. I want to think it all the way to the end, but it's quite late. So I'll just start...

You probably have an equity advantage, but it isn't that big and you have a playing disadvantage (large field reduces your postflop edge with non-drawing hands) which negates most of what that advantage might be. So I'm not sure I buy an equity argument for raising. There must be more to it.

The goal is to build a pot so that when you flop a set, you scoop a much bigger pot. You may think to yourself that you're putting in one extra bet to get 5-7 more bets in the pot, and so you're short of the 8:1 you need to flop a set. However, in a larger pot, you often find yourself getting a little more action than you normally would (action in a loose-passive game may just mean more callers). In very passive games, a preflop raise may induce everyone to auto-check to you on the flop (I hear this happens live), so that your one bet actually buys you a look at 4 cards somewhat often.

Sleep beckons. But this gives a small start for someone who wants to add thoughts and comments, and maybe even some calculations and stats(?).

[Goodnews]

raise, raise, raise, raise

[Goodnews]

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Hand 1:
Preflop: Hero is button with 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
5 limpers, Hero ???.
--------------------


[/ QUOTE ]

In very passive games, a preflop raise may induce everyone to auto-check to you on the flop (I hear this happens live), so that your one bet actually buys you a look at 4 cards somewhat often.



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ding ding ding

If you whiff the flop and there is an ace, king or queen, you can still represent a strong holding. You can raise the flop here for a free card and scoop this monster pot.

[bottomset]

raise
raise
call
raise

[milesdyson]

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ding ding ding

If you whiff the flop and there is an ace, king or queen, you can still represent a strong holding. You can raise the flop here for a free card and scoop this monster pot.

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okay you shouldnt be raising this preflop

[bottomset]

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ding ding ding

If you whiff the flop and there is an ace, king or queen, you can still represent a strong holding. You can raise the flop here for a free card and scoop this monster pot.

[/ QUOTE ]
okay you shouldnt be raising this preflop

[/ QUOTE ]

haha, true and brutally honest

um OP I think you need to think about your comment more, people don't fold TP in small pots, they never fold it in monster pots, this is a huge pot, so you just waste bets representing a hand you don't have in a situation where bluffing is a terrible idea

basically for the most part your bluffs should be in small/medium pots .. yes you will need to succeed more than you would in a large pot, but bluffs are far less likely to work in large pots.