Push Pre-Flop with Aces?

chicagoY · #1 12-21-2006, 06:21 AM

I just started playing live NL 200 1/2 blinds and I've noticed that my raises evolved from 4 x blind +1 for each limper up to 8 x blind + one for each limper in the hopes of weeding out the stragglers. It seems like someone calls me no matter what. With a few callers and myself in late position, how wrong would I be to push all in with aces or kings?
I think I'd get at least one caller every other time. Opinions?

sdp · #2 12-21-2006, 07:24 AM

I've never tried this with KK, but had great success doing this with AA...this is not to say I haven't suffered the odd suckout or 2 but I've won some nice fat pots with someone raising UTG 20 or 25, 3-5 callers then I reraise AI. This is in the LA 3/5 $200 where there will almost always be one caller.

KenProspero · #3 12-21-2006, 11:03 AM

In this case, I'd measure success solely on the basis of whether you get the maximum possible amount of money in the pot pre-flop, not whether someone occasionally sucks out on you (which they will with statistically predictable frequency).

rageotones · #4 12-21-2006, 11:24 AM

i do this if i'm playing:

a. someone who will maybe call me or

b. someone that is either really good or crazy and i have a tough time playing with after the flop

last time i did it, it was both a and b in a 1/2 nl game. i'd just one a big pot and still had a pile of chips in front of me. ab guy raises UTG to 16 or so, and i look down at AA. i say all-in, and it folds around to him. he calls before i can even get my chips counted for what ends up being 274 more w/TT. we ran it twice, and he hit a T on the first one, so we ended up chopping b/c i run bad.

Percula · #5 12-21-2006, 01:18 PM

It really really depends on the game.

In the short term, if you are going to get the calls, then yes push it, and frankly I might widen my range a bit too when doing this from the button. How wide that range is would depend on the tightness of the table.

The problem becomes in how the game will change because you are pushing. If you do it once in a session, no big deal, but do it several times in a session, big deal.

That type of shear aggression will often change the character of the game. The game will either get super tight down right nitty with people looking to trap you, or the table explodes into a super LAG game.

My general mode is to mix it up, RR, pushing and flat calling, but I haven't played a 1/2 game in over a year so I am not sure how well that would work.

jba · #6 12-21-2006, 01:35 PM

if you think there's a very good chance you'll get called and your stack size / pot size is such that you're getting it all in on the flop, I think it's a great way to play it.

I did this once in a 1/2 game with about 140. UTG makes it 15, four cold callers, I push in the SB. one caller for 100 - he had JTo.

chicagoY · #7 12-21-2006, 07:04 PM

Wow, I thought they only ran it twice on high stakes poker (I'm sort of being serious). I guess it would apply for most cash games.

Percula · #8 12-21-2006, 07:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Wow, I thought they only ran it twice on high stakes poker (I'm sort of being serious). I guess it would apply for most cash games.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually no. Most rooms will not let players do business at the table unless it is at their nose bleed limits. Some rooms are rather flexible, others are not.

As an example, twice I have done business in the Wynn 2/5 game, but ask any dealer/floor there if they allow it and they will all say no. But they also know that in an uncapped game, that the limits do not always matter.

thebeebster · #9 12-21-2006, 07:45 PM

[ QUOTE ]
i do this if i'm playing:

a. someone who will maybe call me or

b. someone that is either really good or crazy and i have a tough time playing with after the flop

last time i did it, it was both a and b in a 1/2 nl game. i'd just one a big pot and still had a pile of chips in front of me. ab guy raises UTG to 16 or so, and i look down at AA. i say all-in, and it folds around to him. he calls before i can even get my chips counted for what ends up being 274 more w/TT. we ran it twice, and he hit a T on the first one, so we ended up chopping b/c i run bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

where do they let you waste time by running it twice in a 1/2 game?

AngusThermopyle · #10 12-21-2006, 07:58 PM

[ QUOTE ]

where do they let you waste time by running it twice in a 1/2 game?

[/ QUOTE ]

If the dealer knows anything, it doesn't that much more time.
1. Don't center the all-in bets (I see dealers center the capped turn action when the board is KQJT rainbow and act surprised when they have to split the pot 3 ways). If the pot is split, the two just take that back and all you have to split is what is in the center. Not that much time.
2. How long does it take to put out two boards?