[Fedorfan]

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no i understand the principle, that on an individual basis, a human life is more valuable then an animals or a plant.

The problem is that when your always putting humans above animals and nature, eventually we'll end up with a decimated planet with 20 billion humans on it. It just seems like we can't see the dilemma in terms of the "big picture".

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That's a nice assertion with absolutely nothing behind it. Humans, right now, raise animals and grow plants for the express purpose of eating them or otherwise using them to sustain human life. What in God's name makes you think that we would suddenly stop doing this, or otherwise compromise our own future, because we think that humans >>>> animals and plants?

I don't think people should rape women OR murder animals, but it's pretty easy for me to conclude which is morally worse. And if you just want to think in terms of which is worse for "the future of the planet," than the answer is that raping women is much worse from that perspective also. DUCY?

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i have no desire to put anymore effort into this kind of a debate, so I'll simply say that i disagree and don't think you understand the points i was trying to make; in saying how important things like wildlife, rainforest's, and the oceans are to the longterm health of the human race. And attitude's like one human life is more important then all X type of animal or Y type of plant is foolish imo.