[nietzreznor]

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But everyone disagrees as to what rights we really have, so that gets us nowhere.

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Well, no one is saying its not a practical problem; if there was no disagreement, then we wouldn't need to have this discussion and there'd already be no state to worry about [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]
But this is like saying that it "gets us nowhere" to try and find the correct economic theory because there is such widespread disagreement. But so what? People disagree about stuff all the time; we have these arguments to find the correct answers.

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Except, of course, that the most forceful group gets to mandate it's conception of real rights.

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Might will generally make right, if we're talking about legal rights or de facto rights. But while powerful people or groups might try to mold legal/de facto rights as they see fit, they can never change our natural rights, since natural rights are prescriptions for how people should be treated and have no connection with how people actually are treated.
So no group or person can ever mandate our natural rights--at best they can trick people into believing that they don't exist.