[Nuevo99]

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The dinosaur to be put to rest is the idea that showing our cards has to be some huge ego buster or an act of shame. The simple situation of someone asking what a bettor has before calling (or after folding) frequently invokes the worn out statement "you gotta pay to see them". Well, if I pay the price (or my opponent pays the price), then I'm entitled to see the cards and I'm not going to get into some ego driven pissing contest with someone if they want to see my cards (if they've paid the price). I also believe that, esp at low-limit tables, most of the players will call just because they are curious and the info they get out of it is either misused or most often, not used at all to their benefit. The only time part of this rule is abused is when players not in the hand insist upon seeing the cards. In these circumstances it's typically some old fart who feels some overwhelming compulsion to exert control in anyway he can and wheezes "Waddit he have? Turn those cards over!". This is when it truly slows the game down and does aggrevate me, not due to some precious piece of info being taken from me, but because it can start to cut into my valuable playing time.

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You are right, showing your cards shouldnt be some ego buster or act of shame. If you have to show, so be it.

But in your example where you pay the price, you shouldnt even have to invoke the rule because the bettor is supposed to show first by rule. That's just part of the game, anytime you are the aggressor with a weak hand, you should run the risk of having to show (unless you muck your hand instead before the other guy shows).

Then if he shows, then you have a right to muck your hand if you lost. It's not about ego, it's just the rules. Using the IWTSTH rule at that point becomes just rude.

Concealing information when you can is just as a part of the game as gaining information. The IWTSTH rule was never intended to be about gaining information so it's a bad rule. (otherwise the rule should be that everyone should just turn their hands up all at the same time, do you do this everytime?)

I do agree when a person who is not even in the hand uses the IWTSTH rule it's way worse. That's just beyond rude then. If the bettor asks to see my hand, I dont think it's right, but Im not nearly as annoyed as when it's someone that wasnt even playing in the hand (they didnt invest anything in it for one).