Two Plus Two Newer Archives - KK against aggression

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KK against aggression

Comments on all streets welcome.
Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 calls, 1 fold, MP3 calls, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB calls, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, MP1 checks, MP3 checks, Hero bets, SB raises, BB folds, MP1 folds, MP3 calls, Hero 3-bets, SB caps, MP3 calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (11 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, MP3 calls, Hero calls.

River: (14 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, MP3 bets, Hero raises, SB folds, MP3 3-bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 20 BB
Main Pot: 20 BB, between MP3 and Hero.

Re: KK against aggression

I think you should cut your hand where MP bets the river, seeing his 3-bet will definately colour the responses.

When SB checks the river I think there's a big risk he's not calling 2 bets back to him (sure, he might not even call 1 if he's on a fd). However, after the flop getting capped and MP leads into you I don't think you're ahead enough with just a pair to raise profitably. Also we would like an overcall. Easy call imo.

Re: KK against aggression

Raise the turn and call down if you get 3-bet.

Re: KK against aggression

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Raise the turn and call down if you get 3-bet.

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That's too aggressive.

/Nick R - Not afraid of giving weak advice

Re: KK against aggression

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Raise the turn and call down if you get 3-bet.

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That's too aggressive.

/Nick R - Not afraid of giving weak advice

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Our styles differ greatly apparently, because this is a standard turn raise for me. Probably because everyone's read is that I'm a fishy LAGtard who somehow keeps getting lucky every hand...Postflop will look different for different players here and can still be correct. The more I learn about this game, the more I realize how much the opposition's perception of you and your play style play roles in making a decision like this.

Edit: OOPS I could swear I was in small stakes short-handed this whole time, my bad I'll be more careful in the future. I still feel the turn is close for full ring, but I totally understand the calldown. At 6max you'd need to raise turn IMO.

Re: KK against aggression

I think you are probably up against a hand that has you beat. When you get capped on the flop, I would be thinking about 2pair or trips although the villan could have a drawing hand. Afterall he is the SB. I think you go into call down mode after the flop.

Re: KK against aggression

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I think you are probably up against a hand that has you beat. When you get capped on the flop, I would be thinking about 2pair or trips although the villan could have a drawing hand. Afterall he is the SB. I think you go into call down mode after the flop.

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I like this line!

Am I weak tight??

Re: KK against aggression

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I think you are probably up against a hand that has you beat. When you get capped on the flop, I would be thinking about 2pair or trips although the villan could have a drawing hand. Afterall he is the SB. I think you go into call down mode after the flop.

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I like it too Weak Line forms Behind Pocketjacks

I like this line!

Am I weak tight??

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Re: KK against aggression

I bet MP3 had 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 10 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Re: KK against aggression

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Comments on all streets welcome.
Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 calls, 1 fold, MP3 calls, Hero raises, 1 fold, SB calls, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB checks, MP1 checks, MP3 checks, Hero bets, SB raises, BB folds, MP1 folds, MP3 calls, Hero 3-bets, SB caps, MP3 calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (11 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, MP3 calls, Hero calls.

River: (14 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, MP3 bets, Hero raises, SB folds, MP3 3-bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 20 BB
Main Pot: 20 BB, between MP3 and Hero.

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I only call the flop check raise and then raise on the turn...The better is on the left with a caller in the middle..You can not make it incorrect by raising the flop and by showing aggression both pre flop and on the flop you will very likely get checked to on the turn.. After having the flop capped I would still raise the turn SB could be over playing hands such as TP,TT-88, or FD/SD and MP is showing no aggression just calling...When MP wakes up on the river after showing NO aggression thru out the hand I would only call..If he has you beat you will be 3 bet if he is bluffing he will fold..Raising will often fold the SB who has now only checked...

Re: KK against aggression

MP3 had pocket jacks.

Re: KK against aggression

Preflop - Standard

Flop - Standard

Turn - Standard. I'd hate to raise here for a free showdown and then get 3bet forcing me to fold.

River - MP3 betting out while he called 2 cold on the flop is very fishy. I don't think he made a set of JJ. He could be slowplaying a monster all the way to the river, maybe 77. I would probably just call the river instead of rasing it. You're likely to be called only by the better hand here rather than something you beat.

Re: KK against aggression

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Turn - Standard. I'd hate to raise here for a free showdown and then get 3bet forcing me to fold.

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Why would you fold to a 3-bet?

Why would you be raising for a free showdown?

Re: KK against aggression

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That's too aggressive.

/Nick R - Not afraid of giving weak advice

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What hands are you worried about Nick? I really doubt villain would play a set like this. I'm expecting just a pair here most of the time. Sometimes a set, flush draw, or straight draw. I defenetely think there is an argument for raising the turn for value.

Re: KK against aggression

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That's too aggressive.

/Nick R - Not afraid of giving weak advice

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What hands are you worried about Nick? I really doubt villain would play a set like this. I'm expecting just a pair here most of the time. Sometimes a set, flush draw, or straight draw. I defenetely think there is an argument for raising the turn for value.

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I agree, this check/raise looks like a weak hand trying to clear the field and hope we're on overs. But how often will this weak hand (probably a mid PP) cap the flop when we're telling him we have a big pair? I'm not sure. And I don't think all 2/4 players realise bet/3-betting is the best thing to do. I think many players check/raise the flop when they flop a set here just because they flopped a set and they know we raised preflop.

Still I think the quite suspect lines he's taken justfies a turn raise. Especially since it's one extra player in the pot. HU I probably just call down.

Good points!

Re: KK against aggression

Just look at the action preflop and flop. What's the point of raising the turn when you'll only get 3bet by a hand that beats you. You can't force the guy a fold in this situation because he's not going to fold AA,KK,JJ. If I raise the turn I'm folding to a 3bet because I'm more likely behind here with 2 outs than ahead.