What is the turn play?
 

No reads on this player. What is the correct play?


PokerStars 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (8 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is SB with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 raises</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP2 calls.

Flop: (7 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, MP2 checks.

Turn: (3.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (5.50 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 7.50 BB

Re: What is the turn play?
 

Bet the flop and take it from there. Turn/River call is pretty freaking terrible.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

not betting the flop turns it into a guessing game......take the lead and bet the flop and go from there

you do realise you only have 2pair and jack high on the turn, right?

Im expecting villain to be have A10/AJ and betting for value on the turn and hoping he isnt splitting the pot if he suspects you have an ace....

Re: What is the turn play?
 

You think bet the flop with two jacks and two overcards? And then if he raises I should fold. Or if he calls, then fold? or continue?

Re: What is the turn play?
 

: toxic grunch :

Ach!

Very difficult.

He could have slow-played the flop fearful of not getting any action with his trip kings or flopped Qs full. Alternatively he has much less and took your check as weakness.

Maybe he thinks with a double-paired board his A high would be good (although I might tend to ascribe that kind of thinking to an advanced player: dunno if I'm off-beam there).

I'd probably play it how you did. But I susepct betting the turn and folding to a raise might be recommended by better players; you'll have at least have made an attempt to find out where you stood. The way you played it you never get to find out til the river.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

I know you didn't ask this question, but please bet the flop.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

[ QUOTE ]
you do realise you only have 2pair and jack high on the turn, right?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ha! Dunno about OP, but that had escaped me.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

[ QUOTE ]
You think bet the flop with two jacks and two overcards? And then if he raises I should fold. Or if he calls, then fold? or continue?

[/ QUOTE ]

This depends on the opponent.

Bet/folding the turn either way can't be too bad since you have Jack-high and are drawing dead against anything that isn't a total bluff.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

Yes, if I went as far as the turn, I should have bet there and, yes I would be drawing dead against anything but a total bluff.

I suspect a bluff more often than it ever comes. That's what kept me going in this hand.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You think bet the flop with two jacks and two overcards? And then if he raises I should fold. Or if he calls, then fold? or continue?

[/ QUOTE ]

This depends on the opponent.

Bet/folding the turn either way can't be too bad since you have Jack-high and are drawing dead against anything that isn't a total bluff.

[/ QUOTE ]

What value is there in betting the turn?

You aren't folding a better hand, and he's not calling your bet with anything worse than J high.

Bet the flop because you might still have the best hand, and its very easy to fold to a raise.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

AK13 - That seems like the right thing to do--fold to a raise on the flop bet.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

[ QUOTE ]
What value is there in betting the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

It keeps you from getting bluffed out by low pockets, or random cards that stupidly peeled the flop and now decide to bluff the scare board now that you checked. (if the flop action went bet/call this only has to work a little under 25% of the time)

EDIT: Just realized I didn't make this so clear, I agree that bet-folding the flop is best, I was talking about the times that we bet the flop and get flat called. Checking the flop sucks and check-calling the late streets sucks more.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

So after we bet the flop and say we are flat called. What would be the move on the turn? bet? c/r?

I always seem to get messed up after getting flat called and out of position.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

grunch

uhhh you realize your hand is KKQQJ right...

Re: What is the turn play?
 

Preflop you did fine. Continue to read the forums, though. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] After checking the turn you can fold.

Re: What is the turn play?
 

grunch
after 3betting preflop i think your best play on the flop is bet/fold to a raise
assuming he flat calls your flop bet your options are c/f or b/f the turn. with that specific turn card i don't bet very often.
i think check-calling the turn is a disaster