9Ts vs LAG
 

This table is crazy. Villan is a maniac, and I have been at the table with him for a while. He will c-bet with a PSB every time, and will never bet less than the entire pot. Over 180 hands that session, he was at one point a 97 vp$ip/56 pfr%. He is aggro and willing to bet with air/pair/monster/etc.

CO is mason55. He's loosening up to get in more hands vs villan. Keep note of him when thinking about this hand. Mason is pretty tricky and likes to float (douche) and stuff like that.

Hero is down almost 2 buyins already from this high variance table (KK vs AA pf and QJs flush against a rivered boat vs maniac). I however have built my stack up and now this deep stacked hand comes up...

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.50/$1
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $109
UTG+1: $321.10
CO: $127
Button: $79.90
Hero: $193.30
BB: $202.65

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is SB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
UTG folds, <font color="#cc3333">UTG+1 raises to $3</font>, CO calls $3, Button folds, Hero calls $2.5, BB folds.

Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($10, 3 players)
<font color="#cc3333">Hero ... (leads or c/rs is the question).

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

If he's a maniac, I'm gonna check raise 90% of the time here. The amount depends on the action in front of me.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

Lead so you can 3-bet it when raised

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

I bet pot hoping I will be raised. 3-bet if raised.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

See the problem I see with leading is villan is willing to bet but not call as much. Also, theres still mason to think about [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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If he's a maniac, I'm gonna check raise 90% of the time here. The amount depends on the action in front of me.

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lead then 3-bet gets more $$ in the pot

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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See the problem I see with leading is villan is willing to bet but not call as much. Also, theres still mason to think about [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

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well, given that additional info - I'm more inclined to checkraise

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

This isn't the kind of flop that a goof like Mason is going to mess around on with his floatery. I like the c/r. I really like c/c, c/r ai turn blank. But I'm a tricky, trappy weak/tight calling station, so you probably don't have that move in your arsenal. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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This isn't the kind of flop that a goof like Mason is going to mess around on with his floatery. I like the c/r. I really like c/c, c/r ai turn blank. But I'm a tricky, trappy weak/tight calling station, so you probably don't have that move in your arsenal. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

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Agreed. I think I like a c/c on the flop and c/r on the turn given that villain isn't the type that will slowdown when he doesnt meet aggression

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

reasonable move aj, I thought about it. Deeper stacks kindve make that harder though.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

Option 1) Lead out the flop and 3-bet mason all-in

Option 1A) c/c flop and check raise all-in a safe turn.

Just mix those two plays up and throw in a min-raise here and there and mason won't know what hit him [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

check raise the flop and catch mason in the middle.

that board is very pretty. There is a high likely hood of you checking, villain betting, mason raising with his combo draw/2 pair and or isolation, then you push.

or if mason floats villain's flop bet, you make a substantial raise on top.

People will suggest lead, 3bet, but because villain's range is so wide preflop, its unlikely he has a TP+ hand here and thus he might not raise. This is a very good flop for lead, 3bet if villain's preflop raise range is narrow to premium hands but because villain's range is so wide, therefore he is less likely to raise you on the flop if you lead it.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

amoeba,

Interesting point. If orange is certain that villain is going to throw out a PSB then I change my answer to your line.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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check raise the flop and catch mason in the middle.

that board is very pretty. There is a high likely hood of you checking, villain betting, mason raising with his combo draw/2 pair and or isolation, then you push.

or if mason floats villain's flop bet, you make a substantial raise on top.

People will suggest lead, 3bet, but because villain's range is so wide preflop, its unlikely he has a TP+ hand here and thus he might not raise. This is a very good flop for lead, 3bet if villain's preflop raise range is narrow to premium hands but because villain's range is so wide, therefore he is less likely to raise you on the flop if you lead it.

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this is exactly what i told orange

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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People will suggest lead, 3bet, but because villain's range is so wide preflop, its unlikely he has a TP+ hand here and thus he might not raise. This is a very good flop for lead, 3bet if villain's preflop raise range is narrow to premium hands but because villain's range is so wide, therefore he is less likely to raise you on the flop if you lead it.

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good point - nh

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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check raise the flop and catch mason in the middle.

that board is very pretty. There is a high likely hood of you checking, villain betting, mason raising with his combo draw/2 pair and or isolation, then you push.

or if mason floats villain's flop bet, you make a substantial raise on top.

People will suggest lead, 3bet, but because villain's range is so wide preflop, its unlikely he has a TP+ hand here and thus he might not raise. This is a very good flop for lead, 3bet if villain's preflop raise range is narrow to premium hands but because villain's range is so wide, therefore he is less likely to raise you on the flop if you lead it.

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this is exactly what i told orange

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ditto

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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that board is very pretty. There is a high likely hood of you checking, villain betting, mason raising with his combo draw/2 pair and or isolation, then you push.



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This would be the ideal happenstance.

If villian bets, and Mason calls, then I wouldn't mind a call, and planned turn c/r.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

I'll post results when mason responds. Should take him a while because he's an idiot. jk mason, you know your mah dawwgg [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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CO is mason55. He's loosening up to get in more hands vs villan. Keep note of him when thinking about this hand. Mason is pretty tricky and likes to float (douche) and stuff like that.


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Lol. As everyone said c/r bc a lead is likely to get a call from maniac and float from mason if he has any draw

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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that board is very pretty. There is a high likely hood of you checking, villain betting, mason raising with his combo draw/2 pair and or isolation, then you push.



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This would be the ideal happenstance.

If villian bets, and Mason calls, then I wouldn't mind a call, and planned turn c/r.

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Really? Seems to me a lot of cards you don't want to see fall on the turn here. Any spade, an Ace or a T, heck a K,Q,J isn't pretty.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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that board is very pretty. There is a high likely hood of you checking, villain betting, mason raising with his combo draw/2 pair and or isolation, then you push.



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This would be the ideal happenstance.

If villian bets, and Mason calls, then I wouldn't mind a call, and planned turn c/r.

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Really? Seems to me a lot of cards you don't want to see fall on the turn here. Any spade, an Ace or a T, heck a K,Q,J isn't pretty.

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I agree.
This hand is good but very vulnerable.
Slowplaying a vulnerable hand in a multiway pot is asking for trouble.
CR flop.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

In any other situation, I would b/3 bet here. But this presents a perfect opportunity to trap two players and come over the top with a huge raise.
I have to disagree with AJ, I don't like a check/call here, because about half the deck kills either your action or your hand on the turn.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

and a big CR might look like a big semi-bluff to mason

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

cr because you say villain is lag so let him do the betting for you. maybe get mason involved as well if he knows the image of villain as lag. hell mason might even do the raising for you. check raise is my favorite play here

problem with leading with this flop is when we get flat called esp in both spots and a scare card hits. i wanna get my whole stack in on this flop or at least a big potion of it as you are pretty deep here

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

I like b/c on flop, c/r all in on turn. I think you have to lead this. If villain has no hand all you're getting is his pot sized CB. If he has a hand he's raising you and I might get involved with whatever I have (two pair, set, etc). A c/r is going to scare me off for sure because I know you're a nit. A bet/call then turn check/raise will get tons of money in the pot. If I have a hand I will call this with any type of hand, then you can trap me on the turn when you c/r all in. I'm willing to risk letting a scare card come off for the chance to stack all of us.

If you bet and villain just calls then PSB turn again. If you bet, villain calls, and I raise THEN I think you can 3b all in. Obv if you bet, villain raises and I 3 bet you push.

It took me so long to respond because I have a JOB. I go to work and do work and I have already gotten a lecture about browsing 2p2 at work this week.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

Obvious c/r imo. Maniac is potting this all day. Mason may get frisky and try to isolate with one pair or something.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

CR for sure. If villian is betting every flop, then get as much as possible in on the flop.

HOWEVER; I really would also like an overbet-lead. I know this sounds quirky, but it might just get villian to make some retarded bluff or call with Qx. If he's really that aggro, I think it could set him off.

If you don't like that option, then make a big CR and push safe turns.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

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I like b/c on flop, c/r all in on turn. I think you have to lead this. If villain has no hand all you're getting is his pot sized CB. If he has a hand he's raising you and I might get involved with whatever I have (two pair, set, etc). A c/r is going to scare me off for sure because I know you're a nit. A bet/call then turn check/raise will get tons of money in the pot. If I have a hand I will call this with any type of hand, then you can trap me on the turn when you c/r all in. I'm willing to risk letting a scare card come off for the chance to stack all of us.

If you bet and villain just calls then PSB turn again. If you bet, villain calls, and I raise THEN I think you can 3b all in. Obv if you bet, villain raises and I 3 bet you push.

It took me so long to respond because I have a JOB. I go to work and do work and I have already gotten a lecture about browsing 2p2 at work this week.

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I see where you are coming from with this but I think this is a pot I dont mind winning on the flop with a checkraise.

Re: 9Ts vs LAG
 

Sorry, been away at spring break trip for a while, and am still on it. I get back on sat/sunday so until then, no poker/2p2 I guess.

Anyways, results. I definitely think c/r is best on this hand. this villan will PSB 100% of the time. c/c might be ok if it wasn't such a drawy board. I led, he miniraised, mason folded, I 3-bet and he folded. Thanks for replies.