FPHG available
 

Well in the light of the other post about the Party Handgrabber loophole, I decided to release my own version of this for everybody to use.

I hope by doing this that this puts an end to all the profit making from this loophole (which I personally think is wrong). Some will not be happy that I released this, but I personally believe this is the 'correct' thing to do, and I am prepared to stand up and support my beliefs... [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

As was pointed out in another post this really is not a hard thing to do or code up for somebody with a reasonable level of low-level coding knowledge. I spend about 1/2 a day on this, but right enough it doesn't have a flashy interface and it a typical "Juk Hack" for want of a better word. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

The zipfile, along with the source can be found here (Right click and use "Save as").

Make sure you read the README.TXT file first, as it mentions some of the problems you may encounter while using FreePHG.

Any problems then just PM or email me and I will try to help. Also, if anybody finds some neat fixes or optimizations then please share. Like I said before I didn't spend long coding this up and their is alot that could be done to improve it.

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

PS: This is one of "my" zip-files on my free host [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img] - Feel free to re-host and post a new link if there are any problems with downloading it.

edit: changed title to slightly appease the secrecy camp.
edit: twice. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
-Sam

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

juk,

holy holy holy holy hoyl crap.

this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.

i haven't tried it yet as i am too excited will report back later with trip report.

thank-you so much.
sean

edit--my only thought is i wonder if it might be more prudent to take a stealthier approach so not to draw party's notice too quickly (re: the title of the post) ---like with the previous application.

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

does it track mucked hole cards?

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

Yes, the HHF format is exactly the same as the old HHF files - 100% the same.

There is a tiny CPU load bug though, which means on slow systems it misses the end of some HH's which have side-pots. I will fix this if it ever becomes a problem, but so far it hasn't caused me any problems (and I have a slow system and get this happening quite often).

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
juk,

holy holy holy holy hoyl crap.

this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.this is amazing.

i haven't tried it yet as i am too excited will report back later with trip report.

thank-you so much.
sean

[/ QUOTE ]

Tell us how you get on, a few people have tested it so far, and I originally wasn't going to release it, but the other thread eventually changed my mind... [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[ QUOTE ]
edit--my only thought is i wonder if it might be more prudent to take a stealthier approach so not to draw party's notice too quickly (re: the title of the post) ---like with the previous application.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, but I think since I am trying to stop the profit making from things such as PartyHandTracker and HHSmithey, the fact that I have openly published it like this (for free) will be in its favour.

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

do you think this is comparable to what smithey is doing?

-eric

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

juk, nice app.

Will these hhf files stay around after Party is closed?

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

well we tried to contain the other program and that succeeded. the reason for that is because partypoker clearly reads 2+2 and it's an incredibly simple loophole to fix (though i don't think PTH will be effected if they do fix the loophole). i strongly believe that this stuff should be kept underground.

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

I would guess he used the same methods, but hopefully now people can use this for their own use.

I think the idea of selling data is what really pissed Party off into stopping HHFs, and HHSmithy is likely to eventually do just what Party wants to explicitly stop in their T&C.

If Party want to close the loophole used (which there seems quite alot of evidence that they may not actually want to stop this), then they can easily.

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

The HHF file get saved to the same folder where you run the FreePHG executable from, so as long as you don't run it in the PartyPoker folder, they should stay around.

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

very nice Juk using it right now!

is there a way we can load more than than 10 observed tables at once without using windows multiple user trick..

how is this an improvement from PHT btw they appear to do the same thing right?

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
well we tried to contain the other program and that succeeded. the reason for that is because partypoker clearly reads 2+2 and it's an incredibly simple loophole to fix (though i don't think PTH will be effected if they do fix the loophole). i strongly believe that this stuff should be kept underground.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am not sure if this post may get deleted anyway, but hopefully by then enough people will see their is a free alternative. If Party do read these threads then their are 2/3 existing threads which clearly talk about, and show that this loophole exists.

My intention is not to get this loophole fixed, but is simply to try to put an end to the kind of thing Party gets mad at (ie: other people/companies profiting). As TT pointed out in another thread, it may even turn out they left this loophole for us to use (they also left Dealer Chat for some unknown reason, and today's update hasn't blocked either).

I think if they are going to block this then at worse this simply accelerates the inevitable. Also, it is not the end of the world if they do fix this loophole. This is not the only method which can be used, it is just the most obvious/simple one to implement. If they do decide to plug this loophole, then I will obviously not be as keen publicise any other methods I have looked into and will be forced to keep them underground.

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
very nice Juk using it right now!

is there a way we can load more than than 10 observed tables at once without using windows multiple user trick..

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't know of anyway to get more than 10 tables open, possibly multiple accounts on the same XP system?

[ QUOTE ]
how is this an improvement from PHT btw they appear to do the same thing right?

[/ QUOTE ]

No improvement (and clearly zero interface, and hacky code). It just does exactly the same thing as PHT does and took about 1/2 a day to code up - therefore its free and will stay free... [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
strongly believe that this stuff should be kept underground.


[/ QUOTE ]
I agree with this ..with the solution free and more players using it Party may be more likely to crack down on any/all loopholes regarding this matter... I like the approach PTH guy had:he was very low key,the app was cheap and it has worked great..not taking anything away from your work at all Juk. If this can be kept low key thats cool if not both apps may get nixed by Party sooner than later.

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
strongly believe that this stuff should be kept underground.


[/ QUOTE ]
I agree with this ..with the solution free and more players using it Party may be more likely to crack down on any/all loopholes regarding this matter... I like the approach PTH guy had he was very low key,the app was cheap and worked great..not taking anything away from your work at all.

[/ QUOTE ]

If this thread does get taken down, then I hope people will keep using this free application rather than PHT.

It was the fact he tried to claim it took some huge level of 'technical know-how' and hours of work to do this that eventually made me decide enough is enough [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

In reality it took very little time and could just have easily been written in Visual Basic. The Pacific Handgrabber for example is a significantly bigger piece of work (in the order of 20-50x this to decode the raw packet information), and this sells for $5 if I remember correctly.

If anybody goes back to check the original pacific HandGrabber thread, you can see my question about it. When I saw he only charged $5, then I decided against open-sourcing my code which did almost the same (only limit ring games - and it took MUCH more work than this). [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Also nobody listened to my 'stealth post' in the HHSmithy thread, and it is that type of thing I fear is much more likely to have huge implications than this type of app. They have made their position very clear on data sharing, yet they seem to have left several easy to exploit loopholes for this type of application.

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
yes, but I think since I am trying to stop the profit making from things such as PartyHandTracker and HHSmithey, the fact that I have openly published it like this (for free) will be in its favour.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think Party, and similar type companies, really only have two concerns about such software:

1) Is the presence of such software 'talked' about a lot, to the extent that the amount of talk could hurt their market (ie. scare players away)

2) Does the software provide some level of unfair advantage?

Their publicity material talks about their disliking companies who sell such software (or related services), but it is not at all clear that Party mean that giving it away for free is any better. Possibly the idea of someone giving something useful away for free never occured to them! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I wouldn't put too much reliance on Party's written word ("We do not scan your hard drive or take screen shots from your machine.").

Your program, whether it is free or not, will increase the likelihood of Party responding to its type, because it, and your releasing it, suffers from both #1 and #2 above.

The question is whether you see Party's increased likelihood of responding as a positive, or negative, consequence to your action?

If you want the technique blocked (if you see this as beneficial to poker), then you've done the right thing, and should continue to do so.

If your issue is to do with people selling products that you could write for free, so you do it, and undercut their market, then I don't really understand this. The world is full of people who can do things I cannot (eg. make shoes, give lapdances, etc), and I am happy to pay for their services - if I want them. Or not to pay for them if I don't (as I chose with HHSmithey and PHT).

As skilful and knowledgaable as you are, you're going to be a very busy person if you don't like people charging for anything you can do.

In the event that you agree with me Juk, please do not change your behaviour until <u>after</u> you have written a quality replacement for Windows, a spam blocker, and a totally effective virus blocker. I'd be very appreciative [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

Hi

I'm having some issues with the import part of this, partially because I'm retarded, I'm sure. what's the best method for getting these imported into party poker? the Party auto import or the lightning bold auto import?

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

It wont let me unzip the file. It tells me its not a valid archive. Any ideas?

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
Hi

I'm having some issues with the import part of this, partially because I'm retarded, I'm sure. what's the best method for getting these imported into party poker? the Party auto import or the lightning bold auto import?

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm also retarded..can anyone give us a crash course on how to get this up and running.

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
It wont let me unzip the file. It tells me its not a valid archive. Any ideas?

[/ QUOTE ]

No idea why but... Download it from Internet Explorer and it seems to work. From Firefox the archive is invalid.

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
It wont let me unzip the file. It tells me its not a valid archive. Any ideas?

[/ QUOTE ]

Try copy and pasting this into your browser.

http://freewebs.com/jukofyork/FreePHG_v0_01.zip

worked for me.

Now on to T&amp;C issues. Is it true that party will give you a warning for this before doing anything else, assuming they were ever to crack down (and were somehow able to).

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

It is one thing to say that software should be free and to claim that you can build an equivalent app in half a day - it is quite another thing to follow through and do it. Well done!

rvg

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think Party, and similar type companies, really only have two concerns about such software:

1) Is the presence of such software 'talked' about a lot, to the extent that the amount of talk could hurt their market (ie. scare players away)

2) Does the software provide some level of unfair advantage?

Their publicity material talks about their disliking companies who sell such software (or related services), but it is not at all clear that Party mean that giving it away for free is any better. Possibly the idea of someone giving something useful away for free never occured to them! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I wouldn't put too much reliance on Party's written word ("We do not scan your hard drive or take screen shots from your machine.").

Your program, whether it is free or not, will increase the likelihood of Party responding to its type, because it, and your releasing it, suffers from both #1 and #2 above.

[/ QUOTE ]

I honestly cannot predict how they will react to something like this, but I think that many others could have just as easy have done what I have (and I am sure many others have but won't admit it or release their code).

Yes, I could have just kept my version hidden, and until today I pretty much planned on doing this. For example: I had written a Pacific Hangrabber type utility quite a bit before the commercial version was released, but the difference was the Pacific Hangrabber author didn't try to make such a huge profit ($5-$10 was a very fair price for the work required IMO). The comments today in the other thread by the PHT author just didn't go down well with me and my belief system, so this is my way of rectifying it as best I can [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[ QUOTE ]
The question is whether you see Party's increased likelihood of responding as a positive, or negative, consequence to your action?

If you want the technique blocked (if you see this as beneficial to poker), then you've done the right thing, and should continue to do so.

[/ QUOTE ]

No I don't want it blocked, but I think whether their is a commercial version or a free version in circulation will most likely make little difference. I could have kept this quiet and 'underground', but I think at worst this may accelerate their decision making process and force them to clarify their position on applications like this (free or payware).

[ QUOTE ]
If your issue is to do with people selling products that you could write for free, so you do it, and undercut their market, then I don't really understand this. The world is full of people who can do things I cannot (eg. make shoes, give lapdances, etc), and I am happy to pay for their services - if I want them. Or not to pay for them if I don't (as I chose with HHSmithey and PHT).

As skilful and knowledgaable as you are, you're going to be a very busy person if you don't like people charging for anything you can do.

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe this is just my belief system, but I have always believed in the benefit of sharing knowledge and skills, and if others take advantage of this and don't return the goodwill, then so be it. Others may have a different viewpoint on life and different goals, and everybody is welcome to their own personal ideals, these are just mine... [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[ QUOTE ]
In the event that you agree with me Juk, please do not change your behaviour until <u>after</u> you have written a quality replacement for Windows, a spam blocker, and a totally effective virus blocker. I'd be very appreciative [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I have lived through pretty much the whole era of home computers, and all I can say is that a "replacement for Windows" really wouldn't be such a bad thing and if I had multiple lifetimes (and was a more motivated person), yes I would try to right this wrong also, but sadly I don't and this is a different story... [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

juk could you help with that above question?

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It wont let me unzip the file. It tells me its not a valid archive. Any ideas?

[/ QUOTE ]

No idea why but... Download it from Internet Explorer and it seems to work. From Firefox the archive is invalid.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, sry this same problem has hit me multiple times now. Its either something to do with my free host or my copy of winrar makes corrupted zips? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

If anybody can re-host this, then plz do and feel free to repack the archive (the license notice is only to protect myself from problems, not to stop the code from being redistributed...). [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

I appreciate your work to get something free but I really think you are doing more harm here than good. The more apps like these are used the more likely Party will do something about it. So while you did some good I think you've done more evil. Just being honest. If you want to do something like this; fine. However, like others have said, please keep it more underground and not available to the entire public.

Best regards,

APerfect10

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hi

I'm having some issues with the import part of this, partially because I'm retarded, I'm sure. what's the best method for getting these imported into party poker? the Party auto import or the lightning bold auto import?

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm also retarded..can anyone give us a crash course on how to get this up and running.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hmmmm... I moved to using a different utility called PokerManager, and don't use PT much anymore. You could try this if the PT code has been altered to not allow importing of HHF's:

In the run.bat file, alter this line to say:

start /low FreePHG.exe -e txt

This will make the output file a .txt rather than a .hhf, you should then be able to import these files in the same way as you import your own hands.

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

Try using the -e option to set the output as .txt, and then import them as you normally import you own hands (see my reply to the question for details). I don't use PT anymore, so I not the best person to ask when it comes to PT problems [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

alright someone else take it.... what steps do I take to get the files from the folder into the auto import of poker tracker?

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
Now on to T&amp;C issues. Is it true that party will give you a warning for this before doing anything else, assuming they were ever to crack down (and were somehow able to).

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think anybody can answer this for sure, but I think they state in their T&amp;C that they will always give a warning before taking further action (even if you use one of the predefined "banned applications" they list in their "Unfair Advantage" policy page). I think only outright cheating/collusion results in a instant ban, but don't take my word for it. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

I would have preferred to see PTH charge not $50, but $5,000 (or even more, $50,000 would have been even better). The fewer of these things out there, the better.

Which is the opposite approach to yours - I daren't imagine how you'd have reacted to a $50,000 price tag! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I strongly support the ethos behind open source (I am using FireFox now), but only open source (or open information) when it creates some public benefit. I don't think your making it easier for more people to datamine is a public benefit.

You justify your actions by saying "this is just my belief system", which is an empty answer ("I believe what I believe because I believe it"). I could give several horrid examples of very infamous people who have acted on their truly held beliefs, but I would not insult you by doing so.

Beliefs have to (excuse me for being preachy) create value. I think you've taken a highly commendable attitude, and just applied it a little too widely. I DO commend your intent, I just think you could have chosen a better subject to exercise it on (as, in fact, you have done with many of your other posts, eg. AHK scripts).

Keep up the good work though (hint: a new Windows, spam and virus blockers [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] ).

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
I appreciate your work to get something free but I really think you are doing more harm here than good. The more apps like these are used the more likely Party will do something about it. So while you did some good I think you've done more evil. Just being honest. If you want to do something like this; fine. However, like others have said, please keep it more underground and not available to the entire public.

[/ QUOTE ]

My motivation for this was not to cause problems, but simply to rectify the profit making aspect. If Party want to block these methods, then they will eventually regardless of my actions. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I am still not 100% sure they so wish for this to be blocked, as there seems to be multiple gaping loopholes left for this type of application, and they have so far not made any comment on this on their site. The only indication was the removal of HFF files, yet the loopholes seem so huge that I cannot yet believe they were just left by pure chance?

Yes, I could have made a new account and posted this (just like the others have for their payware equivalents), and this way could have avoided all the 'flack', but I did expect people to have very mixed opinions about it and have simply done what I believe was the 'correct' action. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

im not able to open the run.bat file as it tells me that it cannot find freephg.exe.

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
Yes, I could have made a new account and posted this (just like the others have for their payware equivalents), and this way could have avoided all the 'flack', but I did expect people to have very mixed opinions about it and have simply done what I believe was the 'correct' action.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think you are receiving "flak" (and certainly not my intention to give you any). You've done enough good work, and have established a good enough reputation, already on this site, that being slightly on the wrong side of a judgement call (but with good intent), is hardly anything that's going to damage your rep.

But, to use another military metaphor, a tactical withdrawl might be a good plan.

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think you are receiving "flak" (and certainly not my intention to give you any). You've done enough good work, and have established a good enough reputation, already on this site, that being slightly on the wrong side of a judgement call (but with good intent), is hardly anything that's going to damage your rep.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh, this wont be the last time most likely - I tend to be the kind of person who will stick my neck on the line for stuff like this for no other reason that this is the type of person I am! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I doubt if anybody else would have done the same, even though I am sure many other have the same code sitting on their disks. I thought long and hard about the Pacific HandGrabber, and eventually decided against... This was different I think... [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[ QUOTE ]
But, to use another military metaphor, a tactical withdrawl might be a good plan.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well nearly, 6am here (GMT) so bedtime for me (sadly got none of the 1.5k hands I was hoping to get played, but I guess than can wait!) [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

It could be that you haven't got the stuff setup to run command line programs in WinXP? Have you been able to run other peoples batch files before whichout problems?

Also, I forgot to say in the README.TXT that both files have to be unzipped into a folder first (sry if this sounds obvious, but I forgot to put it in... [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] ).

If this fails and you want to use the "-e txt" option, then you can still make a shortcut to the application and then edit the command line options passed to it in the windows shortcut.

If you still having problems tomorrow, I will be back to help then, but need some sleep (daylight here!) [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: FPHG v0.01 available
 

Gentelmen:

any ideas how to auto-open tables ala PartyMine?

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
I would have preferred to see PTH charge not $50, but $5,000 (or even more, $50,000 would have been even better). The fewer of these things out there, the better.

Which is the opposite approach to yours - I daren't imagine how you'd have reacted to a $50,000 price tag! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I strongly support the ethos behind open source (I am using FireFox now), but only open source (or open information) when it creates some public benefit. I don't think your making it easier for more people to datamine is a public benefit.

[/ QUOTE ]

May I ask the reason for this, would you prefer nobody could datamine or just the ultra rich? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

(not meant to sound bad, honest question I'm a bit tired atm... [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] )

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: FPHG v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
Gentelmen:

any ideas how to auto-open tables ala PartyMine?

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

This thread. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Free Party Hand Grabber v0.01 available
 

[ QUOTE ]
It is one thing to say that software should be free and to claim that you can build an equivalent app in half a day - it is quite another thing to follow through and do it. Well done!

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks and hopefully others will come to see this in the same light eventually [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

PS: Sry, I missed this post amongst the chaos and tried to answer them all! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]