Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[image]http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/3...raphvq5.th.png[/image]

549 games played so far at the 24's turbo. As you can see from the graph I getting a significantly lower amount of 1st place finishes.

Going through my sessions, I am finding I am losing my fair share of 60/40's and 40/60's (when I am behind). But obviously there is more contributing to my low number of 1st places.

Problem is, I can't seem to figure out what kinda of leaks I am making. I went through every 2nd place finish I have and almost every shove I make HU is +EV.

So my question is, how much can I attriubute my poor results in 1st palce to just plain bad luck? How much of it is a result of leaks in my HU game? What are those leaks?

For the experience posters here...what were some of the major adjustments you made in your HU game to improve your # of 1st's?

Some reasons I think might be causing my poor results:

1.Plain bad luck, small sample after all
2.Getting to HU being siginificantlhy short stacked.
3.Related point #2, not taking enough chances 3 handed to get to HU with the big stack.
4.Playing to many tables? Not concentrating enough?
5. Not pushing enough?

Please provide some thoughts as to why I am getting such a low # of 1st's and also some the adjustments you guys made that improved your results.

- cheers

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

VPIP and PFR numbers for 2-handed sorted by blind level?

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/3...shgraphvq5.png

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

What is a good distribution?
Obviously the more 1sts the better, but what is realisticly good?
Can some good succesful players post their distribution?

Mine at the 16's is over 1253:
1: 14.0
2: 12.2
3: 14.4
4: 16.1
5: 15.1
6: 13.0
7: 7.5
8: 4.5
9: 3.1

I do not mean to steal the topic, I thought you would be intersted as well.

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

Lots of bubbles there Mattie

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

usually something like 1=5>3>4=>2 or close to that.

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[ QUOTE ]
VPIP and PFR numbers for 2-handed sorted by blind level?

[/ QUOTE ]

I use pokeroffice, which I don't has the ability to sort stats like that.

But to give you a rough outline of my HU strategy:

<10BB

From the sb, I am shoving:
22+
A2+
K4+
Q7+
J7+
67s,78s,89s,T9s

<5BB

I am shoving: A2+,K2+,Q2+,J5+,above suited connectors

Calling range:

Facing a >5BB shove, I call with:
A5+,K9+,QJs,33+

Facing a <5BB shove, I call with
A2+,K7+,QTs,QJs,22+

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

You play the same opponent HU everytime?

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

hi there ekinnehs. I've saw you at the tables tonight, and marked you as an uber player. My software will not join any table you are regged at anymore, so I dont mind giving you advice even though you are a big competitor of me.

Believe me, if you get on my avoid list... you are a VERY good player. There is no need to question your play.. I guess your getting greedy hehe.

Keep on playing your best game, and analyzing your play for possible leaks. You might want to play less tables to focus more on your game.. just play a little bit longer to compensate for the loss of #tourneys played. But then again, your game is so good already... you cannot improve much more, certainly not at the limits you play. Be happy with your results man [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] your more wealthy then 98% of the people on earth..?

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[ QUOTE ]
You play the same opponent HU everytime?

[/ QUOTE ]

Lol, love the sarcasm?? But seriously, that is just my basic outline. If opponnet is tight, I shove pretty much the same range..but if opponet is looser I shove in the stronger part of my basic shove range.

Same goes for calling...the tighter they are the tighter my calling ranges deviates from my basic strategy.

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[ QUOTE ]
hi there ekinnehs. I've saw you at the tables tonight, and marked you as an uber player. My software will not join any table you are regged at anymore, so I dont mind giving you advice even though you are a big competitor of me.

Believe me, if you get on my avoid list... you are a VERY good player. There is no need to question your play.. I guess your getting greedy hehe.

Keep on playing your best game, and analyzing your play for possible leaks. You might want to play less tables to focus more on your game.. just play a little bit longer to compensate for the loss of #tourneys played. But then again, your game is so good already... you cannot improve much more, certainly not at the limits you play. Be happy with your results man [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] your more wealthy then 98% of the people on earth..?

[/ QUOTE ]

Haha...thanks for the kind words. Whats your screename if you don't mind sharing?

Also, what kind of leaks would you say I have based on what you saw? I know I have a few...

If you wanna provide your screename maybe I an help you point out some of the leaks that maybe I see from you.

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[ QUOTE ]
What is a good distribution?
Obviously the more 1sts the better, but what is realisticly good?
Can some good succesful players post their distribution?

Mine at the 16's is over 1253:
1: 14.0
2: 12.2
3: 14.4
4: 16.1
5: 15.1
6: 13.0
7: 7.5
8: 4.5
9: 3.1

I do not mean to steal the topic, I thought you would be intersted as well.

[/ QUOTE ]

From what I can tell, you might not be taking enough +EV situations 5 or 6 handed, resulting in you having less fold equity when it gets 4handed..making it easier for opponents to call you down.

If you are going to be taking 60/40's or coinflips on the bubble, why not take them 5/6handed when you have more fold equity? Just my thoughts...

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

Finish distribution ultimately doesn't matter. ROI does. There's a few different ways to get there.

By the way, your sample is too small to really tell anything anyways.

Ryan

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Finish distribution ultimately doesn't matter. ROI does. There's a few different ways to get there.

By the way, your sample is too small to really tell anything anyways.

Ryan

[/ QUOTE ]

This is how I've always felt about these threads.

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Finish distribution ultimately doesn't matter. ROI does. There's a few different ways to get there.

By the way, your sample is too small to really tell anything anyways.

Ryan

[/ QUOTE ]

Well this thread isn't about what my finish distribution should be. It's about what types of adjustment you guys have made to your HU game that you think helped you win more 1st places.

But anyways, any help guys??

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

I improved my number of 1st place finishes by:
- not missing pushes at t200+25
- respecting regs less HU
- seeing more flops HU with >10BBs

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I improved my number of 1st place finishes by:
- not missing pushes at t200+25
- respecting regs less HU
- seeing more flops HU with >10BBs

[/ QUOTE ]

when u say not missing pushes at t200+25...are you making all those ATC shoves from the sb?

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

I was thinking more along the lines of not missing ATC shoves from the button [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

I make a ton of EV calling regs ATC shoves from the button, so I'd put that in there as well. Obv. adjust your shoving against knowledgeable regs.

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

I think theres just a ton of variance to it. In my tiny sample set of 275 @ the 16s ive got
1. 23%
2. 10%
3. 12%

I attribute this almost exclusively to winning a ton of flips.

If I could add one strategic thought to HU play it would be that sometimes you can sort of tell that your opponent is waiting for good cards to make a stand because hes not calling any of your shoves and hes folding the SB every time. In these cases Im gonna keep shoving ATC till he finds something he likes or I get him down to a place where I know hes gonna call, and I become a little more selective there.

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I was thinking more along the lines of not missing ATC shoves from the button [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Button-You have t2100.
BB (t3100)
SB (t1500)

BB has a semi-loose range. Sb in tight reg.

Are you shoving A3s+,A5o+,K8s+,K9o+,22+,QTs+,small suited connectors...100% of the time?

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

Number of players remaining kind of matters [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I was thinking more along the lines of not missing ATC shoves from the button [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Button-You have t2100.
BB (t3100)
SB (t1500)

BB has a semi-loose range. Sb in tight reg.

Are you shoving A3s+,A5o+,K8s+,K9o+,22+,QTs+,small suited connectors...100% of the time?

[/ QUOTE ]
Not really a good example, you have great equity when you fold there since SB is a reg and will push wide and get called often. I would push something like {33+,A7o+,A2s+,KQo,KJs+} or {22+,A7o+,A2s+,KJo,K9s+,QJ,QTs,JTs,T9s}, "semi-loose" is a pretty vague read when you are 3-handed.

The antes are more significant in 5-7 handed situations and I think it is those spots where it's easy to miss pushes. There's not much point giving an example since all this stuff can just be solved with accurate ranges and ICM. Just play around with some ICM software and see how antes should effect your ranges.

Re: Finish distribution....low # of 1st place finishes...help?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I was thinking more along the lines of not missing ATC shoves from the button [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Button-You have t2100.
BB (t3100)
SB (t1500)

BB has a semi-loose range. Sb in tight reg.

Are you shoving A3s+,A5o+,K8s+,K9o+,22+,QTs+,small suited connectors...100% of the time?

[/ QUOTE ]
Not really a good example, you have great equity when you fold there since SB is a reg and will push wide and get called often. I would push something like {33+,A7o+,A2s+,KQo,KJs+} or {22+,A7o+,A2s+,KJo,K9s+,QJ,QTs,JTs,T9s}, "semi-loose" is a pretty vague read when you are 3-handed.

The antes are more significant in 5-7 handed situations and I think it is those spots where it's easy to miss pushes. There's not much point giving an example since all this stuff can just be solved with accurate ranges and ICM. Just play around with some ICM software and see how antes should effect your ranges.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was missing pushes 5-7 handed at one time, and as a result bubbled more and finished 1st less. If you're missing pushes before the bubble you are not the big stack on the bubble as often as you should be, and the short stack on the bubble more often than you should be.

It could be that, it could be something different, and it could just be variance over a small sample size. Never hurts to look into it.