Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

Game #6285342864: Hold'em NL (£2/£5) - 2007/11/14 - 14:53:49 (EST)
Table "Kaarina" Seat 4 is the button.

Seat 2: Hero (£1105.70 in chips)
Seat 3: rosapante (£507.55 in chips)
Seat 4: Villian (£1183.52 in chips)
Seat 5: JanneGul (£495 in chips)
Seat 6: Lakiadis (£230.09 in chips)

JanneGul: posts small blind £2
Lakiadis: posts big blind £5

----- HOLE CARDS -----
dealt to Hero [A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]]
Hero: raises to £18
rosapante: folds
Villian: calls £18
JanneGul: folds
Lakiadis: folds

----- FLOP ----- [2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]]
Hero: bets £30
Villian: raises to £60
Hero: calls £30

----- TURN ----- [2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]][A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]]
Hero: checks
Villian: bets £100
Hero: calls £100

----- RIVER ----- [2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]][6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]]

(Pot: £363)
Hero: checks
Villian: bets £1005.52 and is all-in
Hero?

Villian is 52/11/3 donk. Felt pretty lost during this hand. How is turn line? call or fold river?

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

call

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

i dump the river and hate life.

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

Raise turn

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

Really boils down to what his flop min raises mean.

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

Xaston. Like I wouldn't know that. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Anyone else?

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

River sucks, but I think I probably would incline towards calling, but that being said I do have some calling station tendencies here and there.

I don't like the turn call at all, i would definitely put a raise in there.

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

How does the river change anything? I didn't raise turn, cuz I don't want to play stacks here being 200bb deep. But maybe I should play stacks. I could check-raised to like $250, and fold to a shove, but that creates ugly river situation if he flat calls. Are you suggesting about getting it in on turn JerryD?

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

whats his aggression factor?

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

raise turn, fold river.

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

[ QUOTE ]
raise turn, fold river.

[/ QUOTE ]

If we're raising turn why would we fold river? I assume you aren't folding if you're raising.

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

[ QUOTE ]
How does the river change anything? I didn't raise turn, cuz I don't want to play stacks here being 200bb deep. But maybe I should play stacks. I could check-raised to like $250, and fold to a shove, but that creates ugly river situation if he flat calls. Are you suggesting about getting it in on turn JerryD?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well you could'nt know he would move for 3 times the pot, that is pretty much the difference now. I doubt he is value beting like this unless your beat (only if you split)/bluffing, so I would fold.

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

because him overbetting the river drastically changes his range? i don't see why the two are mutually exclusive. you seem to be implying that if we get all-in by check/calling an overbet shove on the river or by check-raising turn and getting all-in in that manner our expectation would be the same, but i don't see why that's the case - at all. check/raising the turn gets value from worse hands, but that option goes out the window for the most part once he shoves the river like this, because he's rarely shoving worse here IMO.

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

I'd call.

Your trips w/ top kicker are severely underadvertised here.

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

Agreed with ezdonkey that my hand is really underadvertised here, but he is still hardly ever shoving AQ or worse. If we c-r turn and he shoves are you calling mythrilfox? Maybe the best line could be min check-raising turn(folding if he shoves), and then bet-folding river like $350, (river pot would be $563, and I would have 822$ left before betting).

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

Sorry for the delay in my answer, but basically YES i would play for stacks on this turn against a donk. Now that you just called the turn and he shoves the river, i feel he might very well have a very big hand and you beat.


So summing it up: against a donk i like my hand here on turn and would like to get more money in the pot because I do believe he has a lot of times just worse trips and calls with them or something stupid. But now when you call turn and look weak it's a lot more harder to say what his line is indicating. It can easily be trying to get the max with a very strong hand or he's just idiotically valuebetting his A8 for example, like donks often do. Guess even a bluff rarely (if valuebetting worse in all fishiness isn't thought that way).

Re: Trips, Donk overbet shoves river. 200bb deep
 

[ QUOTE ]
because him overbetting the river drastically changes his range? i don't see why the two are mutually exclusive. you seem to be implying that if we get all-in by check/calling an overbet shove on the river or by check-raising turn and getting all-in in that manner our expectation would be the same, but i don't see why that's the case - at all. check/raising the turn gets value from worse hands, but that option goes out the window for the most part once he shoves the river like this, because he's rarely shoving worse here IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]this is wrong. a donk thinks Ax is the nuts here and will shove it.