Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

Why is chip dumping in a HU game considered cheating? What's wrong with it?

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

Well, for one, it's an excellent way to launder money.

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

What is chip dumping? Is it purposely building a big pot, then folding to "give" away the money to the other player?

If so, then Khaos4k is right, "it's an excellent way to launder money," and should therefore be considered an improper act that the site should try to identify and prevent.

After all, there are more legitimate ways to transfer money to another player without having to make it "appear" as if it were "lost" in a poker game.

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

Yup an example with $100 stacks would be Player A raises to 99.95, Player B moves in for $100 total, and Player A folds.

Great way to get your account suspended.

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

Chip dumping is also an issue in tournaments

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Yup an example with $100 stacks would be Player A raises to 99.95, Player B moves in for $100 total, and Player A folds.

Great way to get your account suspended.

[/ QUOTE ]
This brings up an interesting question for me.

I was once in satellite for $200 buyin Sunday tourney. There were three players left (me included). The payout was 2 seats and third was about $180. For some reason, I decided that I wanted the money rather than the seat (there are no tourney dollars at this site).

So I told my two villains that I wanted third. They were naturally suspicious (I was actually chip leader). The blinds were still fairly low so I said I could either sit out and you guys can spend the next half hour stealing my blinds or I could basically dump my chips and save them time (which I did).

I am hoping this doesn't qualify as cheating. I haven't heard from the site administrators (it was actually at Absolute a few months ago).

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Why is chip dumping in a HU game considered cheating? What's wrong with it?

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I don't know. But in anything other than HU games it's obvious why it's not allowed.

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

As long as you didn't give any indication that you didn't want to win until it was 3 handed, I think its morally ok, but technically wrong. (in other words I wouldn't object as a player if I was in the tournament with you, but if I was a site operator I wouldn't like it).

Goofy one though - from my experience its something you see all the time in a B&M setting where its alot easier to fake a tournament ending than online.

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Yup an example with $100 stacks would be Player A raises to 99.95, Player B moves in for $100 total, and Player A folds.

Great way to get your account suspended.

[/ QUOTE ]
This brings up an interesting question for me.

I was once in satellite for $200 buyin Sunday tourney. There were three players left (me included). The payout was 2 seats and third was about $180. For some reason, I decided that I wanted the money rather than the seat (there are no tourney dollars at this site).

So I told my two villains that I wanted third. They were naturally suspicious (I was actually chip leader). The blinds were still fairly low so I said I could either sit out and you guys can spend the next half hour stealing my blinds or I could basically dump my chips and save them time (which I did).

I am hoping this doesn't qualify as cheating. I haven't heard from the site administrators (it was actually at Absolute a few months ago).

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't see a problem but I don't understand why you had to dump anything. There's just 3 left and 1st and 2nd pay the same. If everyone agrees that you'll take 3rd then there's nothing left for the other 2 to play for. Game over.

edit: I guess since it was online you had to at least continue play until down to 2 so your only choice was to dump? But it's still a deal between all parties so if thats what you needed to do to get the deal consummated then thats what you do.

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

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Well, for one, it's an excellent way to launder money.

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Yeah, and there's no real need to if you're looking for an honest way to send money from one person to another on a site--just transfer the funds normally.

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

Just curious, what changed from the time you enterred the tourney? Surely you didn't pay $200 for the opportunity to receive $180?

That being said -- I don't think it's cheating here, since 1st and 2nd get the same prize, you're the only one losing (assuming you weren't friends with either of the villians).

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

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Surely you didn't pay $200 for the opportunity to receive $180?

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This was a satellite into a $200 tourney. I'm sure the entry was only a few dollars or fpps.

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

my bad, I suppose I should learn how to read English some day :-)

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

You can chip dump without it being detectable.

Use msn messenger or skype. And wait until both players have a monster hand. Then get it all in. You could do this in a ring game too.

One could send money overseas this way, if one were so inclined.

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Just curious, what changed from the time you enterred the tourney? Surely you didn't pay $200 for the opportunity to receive $180?

[/ QUOTE ]
The tourney was a $3 rebuy and I did one buy and one add-on. I actually play in these satellites a lot just for the payout because the play is generally very bad. As well, sometimes I can't make the tourney I am qualifying for so I let a good friend and good player play for me if I make the seat. And as well, a lot of the time the payout just before the seat(s) is close to the seat value so I sometimes am just happy with that.

I have stopped playing there (Absolute) for a couple of obvious reasons and the sites I play now have tourney dollars so I don't do this any more.

Anyways, thanks for your opinion. What I did I think was clearly chip dumping but I think the spirit of my action is not against the integrity of the game. Nobody lost out.

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

I actually witnessed chip dumping in action one morning long ago. In that case, someone had hacked into a 2+2er's account and dumped all his money (~$100k) to his buddy so his buddy could withdraw it. I didn't realize what had occurred until after the 2+2er posted asking what happened to all his money (he was able to get it all back in that case)

Re: Why is \'chip dumping\' HU bad?
 

The main problem is that criminals will deposit money with a stolen credit card, dump the chips off to another account, and withdraw from that account. Then the owner of the credit card will dispute the charge, and the poker site is out the money.

Chip dumping heads up does not harm anyone directly, but it makes it harder to check for fraud, collusion, and other forms of cheating, since more players have to be checked than just those who are withdrawing.

Another issue is that poker sites usually absorb fees on the deposits and withdrawals. Normally, the rake from playing exceeds those fees, so the poker sites are happy to accept that loss. If you deposit to transfer money to someone else, and they immediately widthdraw, the poker site has lost the fees with little or no rake paid.

If you have a legitimate reason to transfer money to another account, most sites will let you do that without chip dumping. They may require that the accounts be active.