Wealth: all in the mind?
 

ill start off with a bit of a brag. on my finance recording, 11 months ago to the day i had £12,500. Today with gold's rises I hit £100K. great in a way.

but the problem is i feel no wealthier. the only difference i feel is that my self confidence is now even greater becuase i feel i've done pretty dang well to be aged 23 and have £100k given i should be in £10k in debt.

But....i am living at home....i only have about 3 jumpers i ever wear.....i look like i cant afford to eat (always been thin).....i cant drive.....i dont go out and spend much on anything (bar now and then when i get shitfaced)....

and then i thought, well, how much will it take till i actually start blowing some on some decent clothes, moving into a really nice place, eat really well, have enough sleep, go away on weekends etc the kind of thing i invisage i'd like to do when i've 'made it'.

the thing is whether i had £10k, £100k or £200k, i'd probably be doing the same - trying to make more.

i know relatively £100k is nothing. heck i could just about buy a garden shed in london for this, but still, it is a lot of money for someone my age imo.

I'm not at all tight with money, just i dont really see any need to blow it (unless im drunk) on things like clothes. like ill get taxis when i need, ill get some drinks in whenever im out, i dont have a financial worry. yet i dont feel like i have more money than i should.

heck, at times it does make me feel really good, like at work when everyone is asking about when they'll receive their £7k loan and im sitting there thinking '[censored] sweet i dont need to worry about that'.

i just seem to enjoy making money, it's not enjoyable as such, just i am addicted to the challenge.

then i also thought, well, lets say i had £5m. what would i do? well i'd go on a few holidays, but then i'd want to go play poker at really high stakes, go try and set up a business or something, either way, it would be something that would be challenging, interesting, with the plan of also making money.

so.....am i always going to have the mindset of wanting to make money? given ive spent so much of my time trying to do so, will i no longer be able to go back to being 'normal'?

ill stop there, i think im waffling, i suppose £100k is a nice amount, but still, i am so far off the amount i need to have the nice house, no need to make money etc, that for now im caught between wanting to keep trying to make more cash vs trying to enjoy the present as much as i can (becuase i kinda feel i should given how lucky ive been to accumulate money via online poker). one thing i've always told myself is aim for a target, and enjoy the ride, becuase when you get there, it probably won't be as amazing as you'd hoped, so you should make sure you enjoy trying to get there (which i def try to do).

for example, i could go for a weekend away to europe and stay in a cool hotel, have a good time, but then the other part of me would rather research in commodities and play online poker. i suppose i am fortunate to have those 2 options available.

your thoughts/perspective on all this and yourself much appreciated.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

life is more important than money, although having money does make things easier.

1) move the [censored] out of your parents house
2) spend $2K to get a nice looking wardrobe and furnish your place
3) poker makes for tons of free time so hang out with friends more and go out
4) join stuff that you like to do ie: salsa lessons - make more friends

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

[ QUOTE ]
life is more important than money, although having money does make things easier.

1) move the [censored] out of your parents house
2) spend $2K to get a nice looking wardrobe and furnish your place
3) poker makes for tons of free time so hang out with friends more and go out
4) join stuff that you like to do ie: salsa lessons - make more friends

[/ QUOTE ]

why the [censored] does everyone talk about salsa lessons as a life redeeming activity?

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

jono, i completely agree (except for the salsa lessons [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img])

1) im waiting to hear back from my trader friend who may be moving to london then i can move in with him into one of his company's flats on oxford street (that will be awesome).
if not a couple of friends have both asked me to rent with them and ill do that if this flat falls through.
2) i tried to a couple of weeks ago, but i didnt like anything in the shops, so hard to find good clothes. i just like plain clothes of good quality.
3 and 4) ive pretty much been on a 5 year bender with a really good bunch of school and uni friends. i feel like i need to retire from going out and getting shitfaced. but that probably becuase i am often feeling tired becuase my brain is on from when i wake up trying to do stuff.

i guess part of me wants to sit at home and chill out and make $$ but the other part of me is saying you should go out and go crazy, but then i think i've been doing that for 5 years, it's time to relax.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

Because if your a guy, and can learn how to dance salsa, and look good doing it, and sweep and lead the ladies around the dance floor, you will score ALOT of points with some very HOT ladies.

Its very difficult for a man to learn the moves and lead the lady, but when you get there....$100k or $3 mill, dont matter, you'll score

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

When I started reading Op's post I was expecting this to be about how as you get wealthier your expenses increase so you don't really feel any better off. Turns out is was actually the opposite. I think you have increased your wealth but not your quality of life.

I would definitely move out. There is no excuse for living at home at 23. That seems like it is in motion. After that you need to start enjoying life more. If you don't start giving yourself some of the perks of having money what is going to motivate you to go to the next level?

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
life is more important than money, although having money does make things easier.

1) move the [censored] out of your parents house
2) spend $2K to get a nice looking wardrobe and furnish your place
3) poker makes for tons of free time so hang out with friends more and go out
4) join stuff that you like to do ie: salsa lessons - make more friends

[/ QUOTE ]

why the [censored] does everyone talk about salsa lessons as a life redeeming activity?

[/ QUOTE ]

LOL, exactly what I thought when I read that.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

[ QUOTE ]
you need to start enjoying life more.

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I agree completely with this sentiment. Look, have lots of money isn't really all its cracked up to be. I don't have nice clothes. Thats because I don't like to wear them. I like to wear Levis 527 bootcut jeans and t-shirts. Sometimes if I'm going into the bank to ask for money, I put on a polo shirt (untucked).

I don't drive luxury cars. IMO, they're stupid. I used to have a BMW but everyone started thinking that I was a big shot, and lots of people wanted to talk about the car (which is boring) so I got rid of it. I drive a compact pick up truck. I sprang for the fully loaded version.

What I've found is that having lots of money is very highly overrated. You can buy lots of useless [censored] like flat screen tvs and stuff. But I don't even watch TV. In fact, I dont' even have cable because I think its a waste of my time. Travelling is fine, but its too stressful for me, so I don't do too much - maybe 2 vacations per year. Mostly I like to hang around with my friends and family. Thats good enough for me.

I guess that the point I'm trying to get at is maybe instead of focusing on the amount of money you have, you should take a look at the kind of life that you want and then decide how much money it'll take to get that life. Accumulating money for the sake of it is really really pointless and stupid, IMO. Get as much money as you NEED, then stop and focus on other worthwhile activities.

The only real commodity you have is TIME. Get the money so you can be the master of your TIME. Thats the only thing that money is good for.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

[ QUOTE ]
11 months ago to the day i had £12,500. Today with gold's rises I hit £100K. great in a way.


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Can you elaborate on this? You mean you went from 12,500 to 100k in 11 months from holding gold?

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

My point was actually the opposite of Spex's. By enjoy life I meant doing fun thing but also consuming. If you are just going to keep spending money like someone who is average then why accumulate wealth?

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

thanks a lot for your thoughts.

firstly i must add i have had an incredible last 5 years (gap year going to oz with a couple of school friends, then 4 years at uni which were so much fun).

the last 3 years i have basically done 3 things:

a) gone out with friends, primarily to the pub. play playstation, watch tv etc.
b) play poker
c) pass exams to get my degree

that's pretty much it. playing poker was to make money, which meant i could go out as often as i wanted to do whatever i wanted, was a great setup. exams required 3 weeks of cramming, missed lectures all the rest of the time. everything was sorted.

but now for a) most of my friends now have jobs (as do i now) so that only leaves the weekend. ill go out either friday or saturday becuase i dont want to spend my entire weekend hungover.

so i guess my reason for making a lot of money, so that i could be financially comfortable (i.e. enough not to worry about spending small amounts of money) so i could go out and party, go to a strip joint and stay in a hotel etc and not worry about money has now gone.

so why am i still bothering? now i have no real reason to make $$ i guess it's become a sense of just making $$ for the sake of it. and it's very hard to shake off, becuase what i've spent 80% of my sober free time the last few years has been playing poker. but now it's gone from an hourly rate of $100/hr or so, enough to pay off my student loan, to now $250/hr, which is a pretty decent amount. and given i am concerned the future of online poker won't always be so profitable (in msnl terms) part of me thinks i really should spend my time still playing to make $$ as i may regret it later.

ill stop rambling now, but it's hard for me to go from 3 years of making money during some of my days so i could pay off debts, go out and never worry about money, to now have a much higher hourly rate, and no longer need to make money in terms of having enough not to worry about spending.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Can you elaborate on this? You mean you went from 12,500 to 100k in 11 months from holding gold?

[/ QUOTE ]

all poker, mainly 8 tabling 2-4nl.

[ QUOTE ]
If you are just going to keep spending money like someone who is average then why accumulate wealth?

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah this is my problem now, it used to make a difference, in that being a student (i.e. supposed to be poor) instead i could go out and spend $300 on drinks on a day long bender, $800 on strippers etc. that made me feel like it was all worth playing poker.

now i don't have that. i feel like i should be spending more, becuase this amount of money will mean a lot more to me now than it will (hopefully) when im in my 30s or later down the line, but there is nothing i really want to spend my money on, becuase i generally get enjoyment from going out, playing golf, going to watch my footy team, schooling opponents at poker. none of these require a lot of $$. so why do i still care about $$$? - becuase i will always have the desire of being minted, i guess it's what keeps me going. also i do have a sense of pride in a weird way how well poker has gone (obv a lot have done a lot better) - the only way to really rate yourself at poker is how much you've made, so i guess i've been used to comparing how things are going by how much im making.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

wealth is just nice so you don't have to answer to any authority. Wealth gets lots of freedom, but can easily turn into boredom. Don't let money take control of your mind or you will be greatly unhappy imo. Wealth is a great way to be able to spend time with your family/love of your life imo.

Don't waste money on material things as much as possible, but use it as a way to not have to work as often and do the things you really love doing.

This is all probably obvious, but when you are going through the cycle of making money, it's easy to miss out on life.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

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The only real commodity you have is TIME. Get the money so you can be the master of your TIME. Thats the only thing that money is good for.

[/ QUOTE ]
Can't agree with this sentiment enough. Fantastic post by spex all around.

I'm different in that I love to travel (as does my wife) and that's where I find I most enjoy spending my time and $$$, so that's where I spend it. To me it's worth taking two weeks off and dropping a month's salary on a good vacation; no one savors the memory of buying their last TV, but I can remember scuba-diving the Great Barrier Reef 5 years ago as though it was yesterday.

But that's me. The point is, find something that you love spending time on (other than what makes you money) and go spend your time on it. If it's something you also need to spend a significant amount of money on (e.g. woodworking, skydiving, restoring classic cars), consider yourself lucky that you can afford it at 23. 95% of people can't, and as a result they always resolve to do it "later" ... and never do.

Best of luck.

Mook

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

I wrote out a long reply then realized it didn't get the point out as well as just saying:

stfu.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

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becuase i will always have the desire of being minted, i guess it's what keeps me going.

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Understandable. I mean increasing your net worth 8 fold in a year is simply amazing but you a still a long way from being set so fully expect you to still have a lot of drive. I'm also not suggesting you become irresponsible just treat yourself. When you travel stay at the nicer hotel, buy nicer clothing etc Small stuff at first but slowly increase it as wealth increases. I find it keeps me motivated so not wasted money.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

The money doesn't mean anything to me.


Whenever I make money I just reinvest it to make more until I make more and more and then just throw it into the bank.


The thing that excites me is the thrill of the chase and trying to do the impossible and getting paid to do it. that's why I have 3 businesses I am running simultaneously and going to add 1-2 more in the next couple of months.


To me, that is what I call fun. Money is just there as a measuring tool to see how good I am at creating my businesses.


Do something that you enjoy first. Because if you do it only for the sake of money, it get's old real fast.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I wrote out a long reply then realized it didn't get the point out as well as just saying:

stfu.

[/ QUOTE ]oh sorry, I was mistaken. Spending all your time in money making endeavors IS the path to happiness!

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I wrote out a long reply then realized it didn't get the point out as well as just saying:

stfu.

[/ QUOTE ]oh sorry, I was mistaken. Spending all your time in money making endeavors IS the path to happiness!

[/ QUOTE ]

wasn't meant towards you zeebo if that's what you thought... basically, this whole thread is pretty stupid because clearly the more money you can make early in life is >>>>> than money made later in life. Also it's not like his life is going to stay the exact same (I assume family + kids eventually?) so expenses arent going to stay flat.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

John,
Completely understand where you are coming from. I always find myself wishing I had more and more money, but it's not like I really even spend nearly close to the amount of money I'm pulling in. It doesn't make any sense, but it seems like the more I make the more I want, even though I'm not even spending much of it.

Some of the things I'm realizing is that there are times I'm probably better off just not worrying about it, spending some money, and enjoying the ride. Things like vacations, nice dinners, clothes, are some things that I spend some money on now that I never would have even 2 years ago. I still don't spend a crazy amount, but it sure as hell makes me enjoy working towards making more money when I can actually ee the fruits of my labor.

Also, completely agree. It's the journey towards achieving your goal that is the fun part, not actually getting there. Just enjoy the ride, I have a feeling we are all going to look back to posts like these 5 or 10 years down the road and smile about "the way it was."

tc

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Completely understand where you are coming from. I always find myself wishing I had more and more money, but it's not like I really even spend nearly close to the amount of money I'm pulling in. It doesn't make any sense, but it seems like the more I make the more I want, even though I'm not even spending much of it.

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While I'll concede that a lot of people are like this I just don't understand. I have friends with the same mentality. One guy in particular isn't rich but he has a net worth of about $300k and makes $80-90k/year yet drives a [censored] box car, had to move because his apartment got condemned for mold, and prefers to pre-drink when going out so he can spend less. I find this baffling.

For me the whole point of making money is to consume. Once you hit a certain number you'll be fine for the rest of your life. After that it is just a number printed on a statement. If I cut my burn rate I'd save a lot more but I think my income would decrease as I'd stagnate.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

I have a similar state of mind regarding accumulating/spending. Its because I hate the idea of working. Every extra investable £1 equates to less chance in future of continuing to have to set my alarm every single weekday.

I have a goal in mind at the moment though - I don't need an entire living income from investments, but my goal is to have enough that (if I should choose to!) I could do random £25k/year jobs, searching for something I actually like, without being broke.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

thanks for all the replies, i was interested to read how others view the long term so thanks for sharing your views.

i usually try to reply to every reply, but this isn't like a poker post where you can try to counter-argue to explain your point, everyone has their own view and everyone can be right based on their circumstances. but just becuase i haven't replied individually doesn't mean i havent read all the replies, i have, so thanks for posting them.

i think the perceived problem in a way is that i've never enjoyed playing online poker more, and i'm now really getting into investing, but to measure my success at both i look at how much or what return ive made. so that's why i want to make a lot, to reflect that ive done well at my interests, rather than to make money for the sake of it. however, in doing so, i have stopped and thought 'wait a minute, i have a lot of disposable income, shouldnt i be going crazy and spending it to increase my enjoyment' but i guess that in fact, my enjoyment is from having a laugh with friends, family, poker and learning about investing, and not in wearing the expensive clothes etc (although nothing beats getting shitfaced and going to an incredible stripjoint [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img])

thanks again for the replies.

Re: Wealth: all in the mind?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Because if your a guy, and can learn how to dance salsa, and look good doing it, and sweep and lead the ladies around the dance floor, you will score ALOT of points with some very HOT ladies.


[/ QUOTE ]

Noted.

Regarding OP:
Just enjoy yourself. Whilst money doesn't guarantee happiness, it sure helps you to be more flexible in life. I'm 22, finished Uni in the Summer and live in London and am financially sound despite not having applied for a job yet (pressing the 'submit application' button is tougher than you'd think). You have to realise that you are lucky to be 23 and to have no current financial difficulties.