12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

I don't have the HH cause it was a while ago, but I have been thinking about this hand alot. I used to think it was a big mistake, but now I am leading toward marginally spewy... I'd like to hear other opinions.

Hero has 9-10 bbs at shorthanded table which has been very aggressive, I rarely have a chance to make the first action, and when I do I have been card dead. Haven't played a hand in about 4 rounds and I could never forgive myself if I blinded out. I am the table shortie and I think I can't fold to the FT (not that I wanted to).

If villian (Durrr) has been opening 2-3 pots per round for about 2.5xbb what should my 10 bb push ranges be?
Do I have any FE? His stack is 30-40xbb.

What happened was I pushed KJ over his raise and he called with 66, J on turn ftw.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

When someone is being that aggressive I'm pushing KJ+ A9+ 22+ alot of times over top. Typically you won't even get a call the first 2 or 3 times you push over top.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

seems standard...I go A 8ish+, KJ+, most pairs...as you get lower (hopefully you don't) expand range...any others close to short? Are you the prime target?

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

{22+, A2+, K2s+, K9+, Q9s+, QT+, J9s+, JT+, 65s+}

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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{22+, A2+, K2s+, K9+, Q9s+, QT+, J9s+, JT+, 65s+}

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don't love small aces...don't play great against any range...I would skip A2-A6...unless I have a great read I assume no fold equity here so I want a hand that has a fighting chance

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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{22+, A2+, K2s+, K9+, Q9s+, QT+, J9s+, JT+, 65s+}

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don't love small aces...don't play great against any range...I would skip A2-A6...unless I have a great read I assume no fold equity here so I want a hand that has a fighting chance

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Villain doesnt have a range. Hes opening ATC when action is folded to him, IMO.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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{22+, A2+, K2s+, K9+, Q9s+, QT+, J9s+, JT+, 65s+}

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don't love small aces...don't play great against any range...I would skip A2-A6...unless I have a great read I assume no fold equity here so I want a hand that has a fighting chance

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Villain doesnt have a range. Hes opening ATC when action is folded to him, IMO.

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how can we assume that from the original post...we don't even know their relative positions on the table...even if he is opening ATC are we assuming he will fold getting decent odds...when in doubt and that short I lean toward the assumption that I will get called...A high is nice but a 2 kicker is very vulnerable

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

A couple similar sized stacks at the other table, but I am the target at mine. I also don't like small aces.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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Villain doesnt have a range. Hes opening ATC when action is folded to him, IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]He wasn't THAT aggro, probably a little less than every other time it's folded to him.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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[ QUOTE ]
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{22+, A2+, K2s+, K9+, Q9s+, QT+, J9s+, JT+, 65s+}

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don't love small aces...don't play great against any range...I would skip A2-A6...unless I have a great read I assume no fold equity here so I want a hand that has a fighting chance

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Villain doesnt have a range. Hes opening ATC when action is folded to him, IMO.

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how can we assume that from the original post...we don't even know their relative positions on the table...even if he is opening ATC are we assuming he will fold getting decent odds...when in doubt and that short I lean toward the assumption that I will get called...A high is nice but a 2 kicker is very vulnerable

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Hes opening 2-3 pots per orbit at a shorthanded table. Obviously position will matter. Im being fairly general. If he opened, and we closed the action, or are in SB, thats my 3-betting range.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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Villain doesnt have a range. Hes opening ATC when action is folded to him, IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]He wasn't THAT aggro, probably a little less than every other time it's folded to him.

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You said he opened 2-3 times per orbit at a shorthanded table.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

brandi..where was durr in relation to you? was he opening pots late position or early...I know it's shorthanded but still carries a little weight...

as to small aces...yess they will be the best hand sometimes but very rarely way ahead...at least A8ish is racing with small pairs...as I keep stressing assume you will be called and even if it's a wide range give yourself a hand that plays well against ATC...that being said if by some miracle you are the first in sure...push your A 3 arrr in

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

it had just gotten down to 6 handed, I should have said that was his trend since about 8 handed. He was probably opening 30-35% of the pots

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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it had just gotten down to 6 handed, I should have said that was his trend since about 8 handed. He was probably opening 30-35% of the pots

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anyone play back at him and what was his tendency then?

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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brandi..where was durr in relation to you? was he opening pots late position or early...I know it's shorthanded but still carries a little weight...


[/ QUOTE ] He was in mp and I was to his immediate left either co or button iirc. He was opening from all over the place.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

nobody had 3 bet him yet

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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nobody had 3 bet him yet

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wow...what was buy in? odd that with that frequency he was getting away with it...all the more reason to tighten up to playable hands...if he's a thinking player he will risk calling a shortstack to show others he will protect his opens...he also is playing with house money from the steals...

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

$215, people were calling once in a while and seeing flops, but not much preflop aggression. He's certainly a thinking player...

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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nobody had 3 bet him yet

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wow...what was buy in? odd that with that frequency he was getting away with it...all the more reason to tighten up to playable hands...if he's a thinking player he will risk calling a shortstack to show others he will protect his opens...he also is playing with house money from the steals...

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He doesnt need to protect, IMO. Hes having his way just quietly taking down blinds and antes. Why ruin a good thing? See, we differ here. His cards are irrelevant to him at this point. If he happens to have a hand one time you 3-bet him; so be it..you still have equity. But, you have more FE than you think, IMO.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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$215, people were calling once in a while and seeing flops, but not much preflop aggression. He's certainly a thinking player...

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You need to open your 3-betting range in these spots, not shrink them.(you probably needed to open them before you got to this depth) Or you will get to 6BBs and be pushing and praying. You still have FE at this point; not much, but some.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

like calling the least...if h's thinking he will realize the value of not folding to your short shove...by showing junk he will show that he will not be pushed around and can keep it up...I know it sounds contradictory but I expect I will need to win the hand at showdown so I'll stick by my range and exclude junk aces...another way to look at it is he is rarely folding any ace himself so if we puh with a crap ace he may call with a crap ace thinking he's behind

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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like calling the least...if h's thinking he will realize the value of not folding to your short shove...by showing junk he will show that he will not be pushed around and can keep it up...I know it sounds contradictory but I expect I will need to win the hand at showdown so I'll stick by my range and exclude junk aces...another way to look at it is he is rarely folding any ace himself so if we puh with a crap ace he may call with a crap ace thinking he's behind

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Card removal effects, will reduce the likelihood of how often he will show up with an Ace.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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$215, people were calling once in a while and seeing flops, but not much preflop aggression. He's certainly a thinking player...

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You need to open your 3-betting range in these spots, not shrink them.(you probably needed to open them before you got to this depth) Or you will get to 6BBs and be pushing and praying. You still have FE at this point; not much, but some.

[/ QUOTE ]In my defense, I got to this spot by doubling a short stack and my game has improved a ton since this.
Edit: it was 2 years ago. Also, I like Sync's range and reasoning.

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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$215, people were calling once in a while and seeing flops, but not much preflop aggression. He's certainly a thinking player...

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You need to open your 3-betting range in these spots, not shrink them.(you probably needed to open them before you got to this depth) Or you will get to 6BBs and be pushing and praying. You still have FE at this point; not much, but some.

[/ QUOTE ]In my defense, I got to this spot by doubling a short stack and my game has improved a ton since this.
Edit: it was 2 years ago. Also, I like Sync's range and reasoning.

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Im not making judgements toward your game. apologies if it came accross that way. I was responding to your post, with the information that you gave. But there is a reason why Durr had 30-40 BBs and was running over the table. But, you are entitled to your opinion. good luck

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

good discussion all...funny thing is I agree that a little deeper I would be inclined to 3 bet more...I really think that given the stacks we have little FE and based things on that...brandi you know the routine well...better to crash and burn aggressively rather than waiting til we have to gamble with a hand where we have no choice...

open up earlier!

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

Yes, I crash and burn well lol.
Apparently I don't save my tilt HH's but I busted from the 50-50 last night in 7th pushing soooooted connectors for 16x bb, be proud pped [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

Re: 12 left in big mtt hand vs Durrr. Ranges?
 

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I busted from the 50-50 last night in 7th pushing soooooted connectors for 16x bb, be proud pped [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

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great run!!... [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]