$60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

Big stack has been playing extremely passively, not taking advantage of the bubble at all. Short-stack is left with 2 BB's after posting the small this hand. I know big stack has a hand, but I think I still have some fold equity. But, if I do get called, I'm either crushed by AA or KK, or racing against a pair. Shove here?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t400 (4 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)

UTG (t5585)
Button (t3225)
SB (t1160)
Hero (t3530)

Preflop: Hero is BB with http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/.../smiles/ad.gif, http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/.../smiles/kc.gif.
UTG raises to t1200</font>, 2 folds</font>

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

I think you have enough FE to push in this spot. If he has aces or kings then so be it. + winning this hand uncontested will give you a great chance to pwn the bubble.

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

You need villian to folding 60% of the time to be able to take the 45/55 against his calling range.

Has villian folded to previous re-raises ?
Have you shown down strong hands to get to where you are at ?

Without either of the above I think you will not get a fold often enough.

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

It's a pretty marginal shove, only time I consider pushing this is if the big stack has been raising all over the place. I had a hand just like this last night, except the big stack had minraised 6 hands in a row, I reshove, he calls with 55 and I get a sucky fourth :P.

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

Wow only 7xbb left if u win this flip u probably take at least 1st or second, who wants to just make the money.

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

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Wow only 7xbb left if u win this flip u probably take at least 1st or second, who wants to just make the money.

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Wow, this logic is soooo flawed...

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

You need to shove this

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

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You need to fold this

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The fact that bigstack has been very passive during the bubble increases the chance that he has a big hand dramatically. Also, he'd be getting more than 2 to 1 on his call, so those two facts combined -&gt; no FE.

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

a shove is probably good, i think we can stop and go, also, seeing as the pot is gonna be the size of our stack if we decide to sng.

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

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You need to fold this

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The fact that bigstack has been very passive during the bubble increases the chance that he has a big hand dramatically. Also, he'd be getting more than 2 to 1 on his call, so those two facts combined -&gt; no FE.

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I would imagine that CLer is raising any pair, any ace, and probably something like KT+. I would also think that he'd interpret our shove as a major sign of strength and would fold a lot of the smaller pairs. Winning this pot (either uncontested or in a showdown) puts us in a great position to abuse the bubble a gain a ton of future EV.

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

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[ QUOTE ]
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You need to fold this

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The fact that bigstack has been very passive during the bubble increases the chance that he has a big hand dramatically. Also, he'd be getting more than 2 to 1 on his call, so those two facts combined -&gt; no FE.

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I would imagine that CLer is raising any pair, any ace, and probably something like KT+. I would also think that he'd interpret our shove as a major sign of strength and would fold a lot of the smaller pairs. Winning this pot (either uncontested or in a showdown) puts us in a great position to abuse the bubble a gain a ton of future EV.

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I am still on the fence on whether this is a fold or a shove.

If villian calls this with a PP at 50% of the time its -1.70% against 45% pot equity when called.

Do you think villian will fold this more often then he will call ?
How much of a -$EV can we take here that we will make up in future hands on the bubble ?

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

I'm in the minority here, but I call. If I miss the flop I check-fold. If I hit and A or K, I check raise all-in. If this opponent is really passive, the hand could even get checked down. I think the odds are too good to fold preflop, but getting all-in and losing is a disaster. If I do fold the flop, I still have a competitive stack going forward.

Paul

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

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Wow only 7xbb left if u win this flip u probably take at least 1st or second, who wants to just make the money.

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loooooooool

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

He needs to be folding a lot or opening a lot to make this shove good, but you might be able to call profitably.

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

Glad to see some varying thoughts from people. I was afraid it would be pretty one sided! I did end up shoving the hand, which looking back, I think was a marginal mistake. Big stack did call with QQ and I lost the race. But, I think it's just too big of a hand 4 handed to just throw away, so in a similar situation, I think smooth-calling pre-flop would be the most profitable.

Re: $60 Turbo- Level 8- AK in BB versus big stack
 

[ QUOTE ]
Glad to see some varying thoughts from people. I was afraid it would be pretty one sided! I did end up shoving the hand, which looking back, I think was a marginal mistake. Big stack did call with QQ and I lost the race. But, I think it's just too big of a hand 4 handed to just throw away, so in a similar situation, I think smooth-calling pre-flop would be the most profitable.

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FWIW, I REALLY don't like smooth-calling. We're putting in about 1/3 of our chips OOP and we give the big stack the opportunity to play almost perfectly postflop, since an A or K on board is always a red flag.

As far as the results go...you can't put a ton of stock in how the big stack has been playing on this bubble and in this level. It's really a small sample of hands and he can change gears at any point in time. However, if you've played with villain multiple times and you really know he's opening a pretty tight range, you can safely fold this.